Douglas County, Minnesota Opens Visitors Center to Promote Kensington Runestone

1/6/2018

This week the new Kensington Rune Stone Park Visitors Center opened in Minnesota to tell the story of the Kensington Runestone, the controversial inscribed slab uncovered in the nineteenth century bearing a runic inscription. (The building signage puts a space between “rune” and “stone,” but the park’s website does not.) Outside of Minnesota, the broad consensus remains that the object is a Victorian hoax created by Scandinavian immigrants, but within the region where the object was found it has a dedicated group of true believers who hold it to be proof that Scandinavians explored the interior of the future United States a century before Columbus opened the Americas to European penetration. The Visitors Center, designed in consultation with Rune Stone advocate and fringe history speculator Scott Wolter, falls squarely into the latter camp.

The Visitors Center is located in Douglas County on the site of the Ohman family farm where the Runestone was unearthed in 1898, and all five county commissioners showed up on Wednesday to cut the ribbon opening the attraction, which cost around a million dollars to build. More than $800,000 in funding was provided through Minnesota’s Legacy Amendment, which apportions funding to the Minnesota Historical Society to support Minnesota’s cultural heritage. The remaining $200,000 came from county taxpayers.

The park superintendent who oversaw construction, Brad Bonk, received a gubernatorial appointment to the Greater Minnesota Regional Parks and Trails Commission in December, giving him influence over future Legacy Amendment allocations.

The Visitors Center is more than just a Runestone museum. The Runestone exhibit comprises the “interpretative room,” but the rest of the structure is meant serve as a public space, including a communty room that can be rented for events and public bathrooms. Long term plans include restoring the park land, including the farmhouse where the Ohman family lived, to its original 1890s condition.

“There’s a lot of people in our county that are new people in the community that don’t know much about the Vikings and the Runestone and where they found it,” commissioner Charlie Meyer said. “Now there’s no excuse for not finding out the information with the interpretive center here.”

The trouble is what found its way into the interpretive room, and Meyer’s offhand endorsement of Norse colonization of Minnesota indicates the strength of belief in parts of Minnesota. The room is decorated in Scandinavian motifs and, according to no less an authority than Scott Wolter, omits skeptical perspectives on the Runestone. When asked if the displays offered skeptical views, Wolter replied:

Of course not silly, there is no credible pushback against the KRS inscription today. All the objections geologically, historically, linguistically, runologically, grammatically, and dialectically have all been addressed. The artifact has been proven to be medieval and it’s done.

The only ones who object today are the dogmatic few who remain steadfast in their beliefs, despite the tidal wave of facts that have drown their faith it was a some kind of hoax. These people now look silly and have chosen self-exile to the shadows unwilling to show their faces.

Sad isn’t it?

Wolter attended the opening and shared his thoughts on his blog. He was happy to see that the cornerstone of his fringe theories, the so-called Hooked X, had a prominent place in the Runestone exhibit: “One thing that especially pleased me was to see thee (sic) Hooked X in the interpretive displays. Some people wanted the Hooked X and some of the other controversial symbols eliminated from the displays, but fortunately, Brad [Bonk] and other consultants chose to keep the runic displays true to the symbols found on the artifact.”

117 Comments

Titus pullo

1/6/2018 09:24:16 am

So the tax payers of MN forked over $1m for a for rent pavilion and “artifact” room? Hellva investment. They should temember that the next time they see a bridge closed or drive over pothole roads and break their struts! I wonder who got the contract and if there were any kickbacks to the “expert”?

Joe Scales

1/6/2018 11:28:26 am

Apparently, the biggest draw for the park are the hills for winter sledding. That's why the place is open till 10pm, to act as a warming station for cold kids. Hence the public contribution.

DPBROKAW

1/6/2018 01:03:17 pm

Probably a really cool place for sliding! At $1,000,000.00 I sure hope they serve hot cocoa and coffee at the guest center. A place where Scott Wolter’s and his dozens of supporters and believers can discuss how stupid the rest of the country is, you know, those of us who dogmatically believe the KRS is a hoax, despite the tidal wave of non-verifiable, or scientifically proven “facts” raining down from Scotts website and his dozens of true believers!

Joe Scales

1/6/2018 01:05:42 pm

It wouldn't be the first theme park grounded in fantasy.

Jim

1/6/2018 05:12:17 pm

Seems a little redundant, don't they already have the Runestone Museum in Kensington which houses the real fake runestone ?

David Bradbury link

1/7/2018 04:04:27 pm

The Runestone Museum is in Alexandria, about 25 km away.

B L

1/10/2018 10:16:20 am

There is a small Runestone Museum in the town of Kensington too. The Kensington museum houses a replica of the KRS made from one of the molds made of the real stone.

Ameriucanegro

1/13/2018 04:48:13 pm

I think the drizzly dowagers can consider themselves appropriately dazzled.

BTW we don't do kilometers here Triple D.

Clete

1/6/2018 11:08:57 am

It appears, at least to me, that the Visitor center is more of a public park for use by locals rather than something that tourists would go out of their way to visit.

Jason Colavito link

1/6/2018 11:23:15 am

I imagine that it's meant to make the park more of a local draw and, incidentally, to provide a reason to visit the former Ohman farmstead. You're right that there is no reason to purposely make a trip out there to see a few cardboard placards in a room.

DPBROKAW

1/6/2018 01:26:05 pm

Wolter’s sure is certain that all doubt of the KRS’s authenticity has been eliminated! Sound’s almost like a certain 100% verified sword story that was going around! I actually like the fact that I’m a part of the dogmatic few who still question it’s authenticity (that and I question Wolter’s mental faculties).

Americanegro

1/18/2018 10:50:58 pm

It's a million dollar way to get people to whizz indoors.

Scott Wolter is an idiot.

Joe Scales

1/6/2018 11:39:30 am

Wolter is on the periphery of this one, and note you did not see him pictured during the ribbon cutting. They're happy to borrow his "science" to justify an open question on authenticity, but dismissed his Templar nonsense out of hand. More and more, he's becoming that crazy uncle that embarrasses the family at their gatherings.

DPBROKAW

1/6/2018 01:22:13 pm

Whatever they think of Wolter’s locally, he is a name, and names bring publicity. I wouldn’t go out of my way to visit this town just because of the KRS Visitor Center, but there are quit a few Fruit-Loops out there that might!

Jim

1/6/2018 11:40:44 am

"Tidal wave of facts" somehow seems like an apt description.
A misnamed destructive force that completely dissipates like it never happened.
Oh well, at least the hobos have a place to keep warm.

Gunn At Risk

1/6/2018 12:41:16 pm

I'm glad to see the fresh approach for Runestone Park. Thanks for covering the news about it, Jason.

However, in my view, I think the "Scandinavian culture" goes back farther than one might think up here in this region, ethnographically and historically speaking, the truth be told, and I'm glad Minnesotans coughed up the money to spend on this very worthy extention supporting a portion of the true history up here in this region.

In actuality, there is plenty of evidence up here to support and corroborate the story of the Kensington Runestone, in the form of metal battle weapons and other iron objects, Norse petroglyphs and, yes, plenty of those pesky little slightly triangular-shaped stoneholes...stoneholes which together represents the glue holding all this wonderful-ness together up here.

Jason, not to be quarrelsome, but there are plenty of folks outside of Minnesota who believe they know the truth about this State's history, and that it really does involve medieval Scandinavians. Anyway, I'm glad to see that the KRS is being better supported by the local community and by the State. I just hope they finally took down Hjalmar Holand's "mooring stone" sign from Skraeling Hill!!!

Titus pullo

1/6/2018 12:47:06 pm

There is a higher chance Roman legions marched across MN than the Norse! Something like .000001percent for the romans😀

A Buddhist

1/7/2018 11:08:33 am

And there are plenty of people outside Tibet, Kuqa, India, or whatever stereotypical centre of Buddhism people of the day are interested in who believe that Buddhism teaches the truth about the universe, yet you would not listen to them, would you?

Honestly, defending the KSR based upon the geographical distribution of believers in its authenticity is a very strange argument.

Gunn At Risk

1/7/2018 08:50:01 pm

A BUDDHIST, there is no argument. The only perceived defense I'm making on the KRS's behalf is that plenty of folks outside of Minnesota believe the memorial stone is authentic as to what its message claims. I'm saying, not only local Minnesotans believe what the message claims...which I suspect is said in an attempt to diminish its degree of popularity.

I do see a real problem with attachments made to the KRS that are not in line with its simple message, as it is difficult enough to get people to believe in it without adding all kinds of nonsense that seems to be in no way connected to the actual self-described story of this masterfully-made National icon.

You are right that I am not open to other religions, and this is because, quite simply, I believe there is but one way to God...one mediator between God and human-kind, that being Jesus. However, I don't see any connection between this and what the topic of conversation is. In other words, I don't entertain many thoughts about other religions, but I am interested in entertaining various historical perspectives, especially concentrating on the medieval period of the Kensington Runestone and a century or two earlier.

william M smith

1/7/2018 11:49:24 am

Gunn - Good to see your work and study of the triangle stone holes that may be part of the true history of the KRS. Keep up the research and it is likely to have support in the near future. I feel the park addition will be very beneficial to the truth of the KRS. The triangle holes are like bread crumbs showing the pre-columbian expedition's into the area. Note: I said expedition's in plural. A new site currently being studied by proper academics in private (not Wolter, Templars or Sword experts) will add to the authinticity you have supported.

Peter de Geus

1/7/2018 02:36:05 pm

Let me guess who 'proper academics' are - the THOR Team......CHARGE! Doing things 'in private', always good for transparency and repeatability. Does this work involve a university or museum or government department or a professional consultant? Will this work be submitted to an academic journal or just made into a pdf for Facebook?

Gunn At Risk

1/7/2018 09:20:31 pm

Hi William, I'm glad to see you're still plugging away, even though it's hard to press your views about stonehole-related compasses.
I like your idea about a "rub" line on the KRS, supporting the likelihood that the tablet was originally placed upright, perhaps held upright by other rocks in some fashion (as a friend of mine recently suggested). It makes sense to me that the stone would not have been buried a third of the way into the soil without any support. Anyway, it's easy to see that over the centuries the stone may have been moved back and forth slightly, perhaps by low-hanging tree limbs or bypassing bison scratching their butts.

Though I'm curious about the dozen or so stonehole rocks surrounding Runestone Hill, I'm not convinced they were made at the same time as the KRS was carved. Therefore, there may be no "sacred geometry" involved with later digging up the runestone, as some think. In other words, I don't support the idea that the KRS was buried as a land-claim. I do support the notion that Runestone Hill pre-existed as a defensive camping spot along the Chippewa River, and I think the stoneholes may have been made earlier than 1362.

Logic tells me that the men who left the KRS at Runestone hill figured that Scandinavians would be returning to that spot in the future for some reason. I think that reason may have been because Runestone Hill was a known defensive camping spot along the route of the Chippewa River...which agress with your stated opinion that there were expeditions to MN, plural.

I tend to believe that the area farther west by the MN/Dakota border was marked with Norse evidences well before they explored eastward towards the Chippewa River. I think all the evidences along the border area represent Norsemen attempting to take up land because they realized through surprisingly extensive exploration that dwindling waterways beginning at ocean sources converged in this area, this spot out in the middle of nowhere. I believe the landscape was marked by stoneholes and petroglyphs in an attempt to take up land there in that spot where these waterways hooked together, completing an immense waterway circle through the interior, from ocean (Hudson Bay) to ocean (St. Lawrence Seaway). This is an area where a land-claim would make more sense than from up the Chippewa River, especially considering that the river reaching the farthest up into the MN River watershed (thereby maximizing a land-claim) is near the MN/Dakota border.

William M Smith

1/8/2018 12:47:54 pm

Gunn - I respect your opinion about the authenticity of the KRS as being authentic and thanks for your related information. As for the 1362 date on the stone and is supported by the soil core samples taken by Daman Capps, Myself and the parks department at Heavener Oklahoma. This dating process of the 8 runic letters on the Heavener stone is the same process we used on the Kansas City Slater rune stone and is approved by the state of Mo. I do have a planned trip back to the KRS museum to show and tell the mechanical wear that exist on the KRS. This is the line Scott Wolter has insisted does not exist, however he can not explain how he proves it does not exist. If the KRS stood upright Mr. Wolters books and claims are full of his lack of ability to read a mechanical flatness gage of this area never studied in the so called 3D processes. I say never because no process to date has depth points established below this line. In addition to the actual depth of this wear line is the fact is passes through the large area of calcite which shows three levels of aging on the front surface. The upper is above ground line the lower is below ground line and the center is the area about 3/4 in. that is the mechanical wear line. Another support for the KRS and its location is sites under study in Upper Mich. and Northern New Hampshire The first site in Copper Harbor Mich. has two items of interest. The first is a hooked X that is the two pointers indicating true north and magnetic north. The 5 fingers indicate the 5 degrees of magnetic declination from Kensington. The Circle represents the cardinal direction of true north. The second is the ship carving in stone at the same area. This small ship is the stone canoe used by Native American to sail west to east and explain the new laws of the land to the five nations. The stone holes you are familiar with are not anything except what is left from the early explorers as proof they used local magnetite to establish their longitudinal location or magnetic declination of their position. The stone ship as called at Copper Harbor should be re-named as a small tinder boat from six that made the trip from Hudson Bay to Kensington. In this stone canoe was stones for ballast and a small sail to cross the Great Lakes to the east. In northern N.H. is another site with the same info under study.

Americanegro

1/8/2018 02:06:35 pm

A little bit of inmates-running-the-asylum is always fun. You can see my PDFs at:

William M Smith

1/9/2018 10:44:21 am

Gunn - It is a joke that over 90% of the KRS research is in the many translations of the runic letters on the stone and the so called codes hidden between the dotted R's and hooked X's. How one can say he is the owner of the hooked X's and make it sound as his invention is beyond belief. If Scott Wolter looked at the tool marks on the very bottom of the stone that make the con-cave surface he may see this is to aid in holding the stone upright. This is common on rune stones used in Europe. Even farmers know that the flat end of a fence post goes into the ground to aid in keeping it from lifting. I have measured the mechanical wear line, however many researchers prior to me can claim it under another name. Holland and Neilson called it a ground line. When Nelson ask for me to measure it during the 3D filming by the THOR group, it was confirmed as real. The fact it exist on the sides as well as the front makes it more likely to have been made exactly like any stone placed upright in the ground. It exist on the left side or cut side where three lines of runs are located, indicating the wear line came after the cut left side and runes placed on this. I am sure the so called experts on this site that go by fake names will provide your readers with proof the Indians had sex with the Bison.

Gunn At Risk

1/9/2018 11:19:08 am

William, we agree about the proposed rub-line on the KRS, and the implications, but you lost me at about the half-way point in your last comment. For beginners, I wasn't award that a "hooked X" was discovered at or near Copper Harbor. There is the Norse vessel depiction, and a petroglyph of a bear done in the same style, almost certainly by the same person. There is also a circle with a single vertical line dividing the circle in half and a single horizontal line dividing it likewise. If you don't mind, I'd appreciate you providing me with a depiction or photo of the hooked X. I think you have my email address. I'm not saying it dosen't exist; I'm saying I've never heard of it and would like to see it.

I don't understand how you came to some of your other conclusions. Native Americans using a stone canoe I'm not aware of. You've added in a lot of material about Copper Harbor that I've never heard before, and to be honest with you, to me it doesn't seem to fit into the KRS's narrative.

You said: "The stone holes you are familiar with are not anything except what is left from the early explorers as proof they used local magnetite to establish their longitudinal location or magnetic declination of their position."

I'm sorry, William, but this doesn't make much sense to me. First of all, in a recent presentation I gave, I identified ten different reasons for stoneholes in MN...five from the so-called modern era and five from a proposed medieval era, and the stoneholes I associate with medieval times are scattered in a varied distribution that seriously calls into question your statement, above, and your hypothesis, too. In my view, the most common reasons for medieval stoneholes were: to mark land for ownership and possible waterway orientation, but also for other purposes such as possibly for concealing buried objects, or even for construction purposes, as with the proposed Sauk Lake Altar Rock. This rock has two horizontal stoneholes.

I'm not saying I disagree with you about any stoneholes being used for the reason you indicate, but I am saying that you should not be attributing all these many dozens of stoneholes to the singular purpose of aiding the use of a medieval compass system--as directional aids. I hope you don't mind too much that I feel the need to caution you about pressing on with some of your rather unfounded views, which--to honest with you--don't seem to make much sense in light of some of the true and actual reasons for the many, many medieval stoneholes in this region.

But, I think you are right on track with the proposed KRS rub-line, and I encourage you to continue on with your work in that direction. Peace.

William M Smith

1/9/2018 01:07:47 pm

Gunn - Thanks for your many questions for clarification. I will attempt to answer in simple terms. The rub line on the KRS was originaly the ground line. When my THOR group went to the museum to take photos of the KRS for a 3D program to allow computer study of the stone we also measured a .022 in. wear line on the front face and sides of the stone. After comparing this with 60 tomb stones with known dates and like environment we established a rate of wear over time. This generated a wear of .003 in. per 50 years in the ground. The KRS has three lines of runic letters on the left side. These letters were carved after the side was made according to the tool marks on the outer edges of the side. The wear line also exist on this cut side which is proof the stone was carved well before the late 1800s. It indicates a 350 year time period to form this wear line. (I CHALLENGE ANYONE TO PROVE THIS LINE DOES NOT EXIST< INCLUDING SCOTT WOLTER WHO HAS TOLD ME THREE TIMES IT DOES NOT BECAUSE HE MEASURED IT). He has yet to explain how he measured it and can not do so because he is not a tool expert that could use a credit card edge and flashlight to see it. It would also destroy his report that the stone holes were carved to locate the hidden stone.
The triangle stone holes of which I have visited about 40 now exist in many other locations than Minn. They have many potential uses such as animal trap securing, fish net securing, bird net securing (Ducks and Geese have a hard time flying when in molting), land marks, boat mooring, pole supports for trail markers, splitting stone and just seeing what materials are in the stone. The 20 or so I recorded of which varied in depth from 1/2 in to 9 in. and of 2 different sizes with in some cases three holes in the same stone and holes on the top or the side all had one thing in common. They were triangle in shape and the tool to make them was a flat chisel and the deeper the hole the more magnetic the stone. The deeper the hole the more magnetite in the stone. About 12 holes have been found on and around the hill of the KRS. Some of these were likely boat anchors which are now in private collections and just like other boat anchors that are near by. Their are the same holes located in a cluster 65 miles west of the KRS, their are the same triangle stone holes north to the Canadian border on the Ramsey site where the film crew from Sweden were shown how the magnetite in the stone hole would point a nonmagnetic floating needle to magnetic north. Their is a stone hole at Daluth Mn. Their are stone triangle holes on the St Lawrence and Ohio. Their are many on the east coast as well as 3 on Oak Island Nova Scotia. I am currently aware of a new cluster of triangle stone holes and the R as well as the hooked X which I would love to tell you about and will when the property owner completes filing the site with proper authorities for protection from the Modern day Templars.
The Copper Harbor site includes a lot more than you stated. The ship, the bar, the circle with cardinal directions also has a hand holding 5 fingers and two inverted Vs pointing north. The hand represents 5 pole lines (magnetic) east of the KRS pole line. The two pointers north are exactly like the two that exist at the private New England site and the two on the New Hampshire Mystery stone which is a recording of the expedition to Kensington.
The hooked X is a cartographers mark for the two norths. magnetic and true. As for you telling me that my findings are short of facts, lets make it clear, I have the Portugal time stone left in Ohio by Michael Corte Real for marking the location for hidden artifacts which local archaeologist have classified them as fakes for over 100 years. THOR stands for a private research group The Hunters of Ohio Rock that has been in place since 1977 and have facts to support our work. I am well aware of your stone hole research and will always support you with your hunt for the truth. Just keep in mind, their was no Minnesota, Canada and USA when these holes were made and the puzzle can not be complete without all the pieces.

Americanegro

1/9/2018 01:59:19 pm

William M Smith wrote: "The KRS has three lines of runic letters on the left side. These letters were carved after the side was made according to the tool marks on the outer edges of the side."

This is an example of the part of your brain that logics not working properly. You can't carve on something that does not yet exist. No tool mark evidence needed.

"[H]e is not a tool expert that could use a credit card edge and flashlight to see it." A tool expert would have a manufactured straightedge, like, you know, A CARPENTER.

"The deeper the hole the more magnetite in the stone." PROVE IT.

Stone canoes!

It sounds like you didn't follow up on getting the 3D imagery from Sweden.

You are endlessly entertaining. You can check out my PDFs at:

Jim

1/9/2018 02:13:12 pm

William, remember puff, puff, PASS.
Miguel Corte-Real was in Ohio now ? LOL He was last seen in 1502 off the coast of Canada when he parted company with his 2 other ships with left with 1 caravel to abduct 50 natives for the purpose of slavery.
What ? He changed his mind and decided to walk to Ohio so he could bury some stuff and carve on rocks ?
Please wait until you are straight to answer.

Americanegro

1/9/2018 03:41:23 pm

William M Smith:

Paragraphs

are

your

friend.

Jamming your text into one long blob risks making you look like a passive-aggressive mental patient. By the way, you never told us where you're institutionalized.

William M Smith

1/9/2018 04:09:07 pm

Jim - You need to get your puffer checked (William, remember puff, puff, PASS.
Miguel Corte-Real was in Ohio now ? LOL He was last seen in 1502 off the coast of Canada when he parted company with his 2 other ships with left with 1 caravel to abduct 50 natives for the purpose of slavery.
What ? He changed his mind and decided to walk to Ohio so he could bury some stuff and carve on rocks ?
Please wait until you are straight to answer.
He was last seen when he left in the ship Altamora in 1502 to find his lost brother Gasper who was last seen heading west from the fishing grounds of Newfoundland. Michael was reported by carved in stone at Dighton Rock as being in the USA in 1511. Also translated on Dighton rock is a lot of other history of the crew of Michael Corte Real. His coat of arms is recorded in the upper corner of the Ohio Rock.

William M Smith

1/9/2018 05:06:14 pm

A follow up to AMERICANEGRO post - William M Smith wrote: "The KRS has three lines of runic letters on the left side. These letters were carved after the side was made according to the tool marks on the outer edges of the side."

This is an example of the part of your brain that logics not working properly. You can't carve on something that does not yet exist. No tool mark evidence needed.
It is your brain that can not read. FIRST - Tool marks indicate the left side of the KRS was modified or made flat by using a straight line of fracture holes with a pointed tool. About 60 of these marks exist on the front and back of the KRS and can be observed and measured to be 1/4 in. deep. SECOND - The carver made three lines of runic letters after he made the surface flat for carving and THIRD - It took Mother Nature about 350 years to produce the mechanical wear line on this surface. In simple terms, the sequence of events prove the KRS is much older than 1898.

"[H]e is not a tool expert that could use a credit card edge and flashlight to see it." A tool expert would have a manufactured straightedge, like, you know, A CARPENTER.
A credit card edge is the best straight edge for this measure and no carpenter tool would be short enough to get a good reading due to the width of the wear line and the overall surface being measured. Once you see the width of the gap with a flash light you can turn the card so to minimize the length of your surface being measured which decreases error in reading. A tapered tooth pick was placed in the gap which allowed a hand held micrometer to read the depth of the wear line by the diameter of the tooth pick.

"The deeper the hole the more magnetite in the stone." PROVE IT. (I did by measuring the hole depth and recording the effect of a compass next to the stone) The closer the compass the shallower the hole. Many samples from each county in Mn. have been recorded for the stone make up which indicates the KRS area is high on magnetite.

Stone canoes! (Just one canoe, picture at Copper Harbor and legend of The Great Peacemaker)

It sounds like you didn't follow up on getting the 3D imagery from Sweden.

You are endlessly entertaining. You can check out my PDFs at:
I do not need to check your PDFs. Most people that use a fake name are not stable or are trolls.

Jim

1/9/2018 09:18:46 pm

William, you forgot to pass again.
Here is a accurate depiction of the Dighton Rock from the Historical Commission of Providence, Rhode Island, published 1830

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dighton_Rock#/media/File:WHEATON(1844)_p564_The_Dighton_Stone_-_1830.jpg

Perhaps you would be so kind as to point out all the Michael Corte Real etchings and the 1511 date on the rock to all of us ?
You can't because there isn't any ! But keep looking, you may find Waldo.
Your notion that Real carved his coat of arms on a rock in Ohio is equally ridiculous. It is a carved shield shape ! Last I heard a coat of arms had distinctive characteristics that separated it from other coats of arms. Perhaps yours was carved by Count Chocula ?

William M Smith

1/9/2018 10:05:52 pm

Jim - I did not fail to pass as you say, you seem to still remain in a very low grade. Your 1960 work of Dighton Rock has been updated and placed in a museum built by the late Dr. DaSilva. Note Mr. DaSilva was a THOR member and is listed as a peer revievurer of my work at The Newport Tower. I also have all of his work and THOR is very familiar with the higher educational status of Dighton Rock. I highly recomend his book (Columbus was Portuguese). The attached shows the current status of Dr. DaSilva. I know the words and dates are hard for a lower grade student, however I will highlight Michael Corte Real and 1511 which is carved on the rock.

Jim

1/10/2018 12:36:18 am

William, Are we talking about Manuel Luciano da Silva ? A medical doctor, not a Historian ?
A man from Portugal, claiming the Portuguese beat Columbus to America ?
A man who claims Columbus was Portuguese ?
A man who claims Newfoundland, Nova Scotia and Prince Edward Island are actually the Antilles Islands ?
The Man who wrote the Book "The Electricity of Love! : The Switch to Healthy Sex! " ?
That Manuel Luciano da Silva is your "peer revievurer of my work" ?
Puff, puff, PASS,,, pass it to me, I could really use a hit of whatever it is you are smoking !

Americanegro

1/10/2018 01:41:07 am

WILLIAM M SMITH
1/9/2018 05:06:14 pm
A follow up to AMERICANEGRO post - William M Smith wrote: "The KRS has three lines of runic letters on the left side. These letters were carved after the side was made according to the tool marks on the outer edges of the side."

This is an example of the part of your brain that logics not working properly. You can't carve on something that does not yet exist. No tool mark evidence needed.

"It is your brain that can not read. FIRST - Tool marks indicate the left side of the KRS was modified or made flat by using a straight line of fracture holes with a pointed tool. About 60 of these marks exist on the front and back of the KRS and can be observed and measured to be 1/4 in. deep. SECOND - The carver made three lines of runic letters after he made the surface flat for carving and THIRD - It took Mother Nature about 350 years to produce the mechanical wear line on this surface. In simple terms, the sequence of events prove the KRS is much older than 1898."

Most rocks on Earth are "much older than 1898". So what?

You REALLY do not get that for the carvings to be on the surface the surface has to predate the carvings, do you? You don't need tool marks to prove that.

"A credit card edge is the best straight edge for this measure and no carpenter tool would be short enough to get a good reading due to the width of the wear line and the overall surface being measured."

An ACTUAL "tool expert" would have just broken off one of the blades in his boxcutter knife... a common tool that most carpenters carry. A much shorter straight-edge than a credit card.

"Once you see the width of the gap with a flash light you can turn the card so to minimize the length of your surface being measured which decreases error in reading. A tapered tooth pick was placed in the gap which allowed a hand held micrometer to read the depth of the wear line by the diameter of the tooth pick."

So do you turn the credit toward or away from a position perpendicular to the wear line? Either way it sounds like more of your nonsense.

I note that you had a micrometer laying around for measuring toothpicks but no tools for measuring width. TOOL EXPERT.

"The deeper the hole the more magnetite in the stone." PROVE IT. (I did by measuring the hole depth and recording the effect of a compass next to the stone) The closer the compass the shallower the hole. Many samples from each county in Mn. have been recorded for the stone make up which indicates the KRS area is high on magnetite."

PROVE IT. Show your data.

Use

paragraphs.

Americanegro

1/10/2018 01:48:14 am

"The attached shows the current status of Dr. DaSilva."

You REALLY have a problem with posting links don't you? A word to the institutionalized: You can't post attachments on this site. Every time you say "the attached" you sound like an idiot. Get someone on the dayward to explain it to you.

Jim

1/10/2018 02:16:15 am

"The attached shows the current status of Dr. DaSilva."

AN,,I let that one slide, the current status is deceased.

1/8/2018 08:48:25 pm

...wow, way to jump from "believe in the verifiable Scandinavian site ON THE COAST of the North American continent" to "believe any two-bit scam involving 'Vikings'."

Brady Yoon

1/6/2018 03:29:49 pm

We already know that the Vikings crossed an ocean, colonized Greenland and parts of North America near the coast. These are amazing accomplishments for people who lived a thousand years ago. What is so implausible about Vikings having gone that extra step in exploring inland North America when there are navigable river systems and lakes that would have allowed them to easily make this journey? Seriously, would anyone please enlighten me?

And it's not like we haven't been surprised before about the Vikings and how far they traveled...

Joe Scales

1/6/2018 04:00:41 pm

"What is so implausible about Vikings having gone that extra step in exploring inland North America when there are navigable river systems and lakes that would have allowed them to easily make this journey?"

It is not implausible. It simply hasn't been proven as of yet. Our ire is directed at those who stoop to fraudulent methodologies, non sequitur and outright lies to assert otherwise.

An Over-Educated Grunt

1/6/2018 05:01:02 pm

Is that rhetorical, or do you actually want to know why it's implausible?

Mary Baker

1/6/2018 05:44:43 pm

It is less implausible than the LDS narrative. We have authenticated records from that era. No Viking DNA dating from that era has been found in Native DNA. Of course, they regarded the skraeligs ("wretched ones") as inferior, even though they were effective in destroying their first effort at colonization.

Perhaps you have not read the documentation.

Those who crafted the Book of Mormon apparently thought the story interesting enough that they used Eric the Red's story in the opening "book" of their work.

An Over-Educated Grunt

1/6/2018 09:47:21 pm

I think all the response your comment needs is that "skrælingar" means "shriekers" or "screamers," not "wretched ones." If you're going to ask "dude, do you even Old Norse," I suggest you get your sources right.

Mary Baker

1/6/2018 11:28:00 pm

Shrieker? Thank you for the correction. "Wretched ones" was what I had read somewhere. I still say it is within the realm of possibility, slim, but no definitive evidence.

Luke

1/6/2018 06:46:04 pm

Where are the artifacts exclusive to Norse culture from that time period found in Minnesota?

1/8/2018 09:01:44 pm

It's implausible because Vikings didn't explore. The word literally means "pirate." Vikings raided and pillaged. We don't exactly have records of Robert the Red or Blackbeard sailing up rivers for peaceful exploration, either.

SCANDINAVIANS explored. And what makes it implausible for Scandinavians to have "explored the riverways inland" isn't that it was physically impossible, but that they did it without leaving so much as one bit of trash, when NOWHERE ELSE that they went did they do this. Not to mention, their general patterns of expansion involved exploring the coasts FIRST, so if they went inland, we should see DOZENS of coastal settlements, not just one. The stone describes an expedition upon which some ten or more people died; Scandinavian death rituals are distinctive, but we have no mound, no ship, and no bodies. Scandinavians were just as hard on their clothes as everyone else, yet we have no (again, quite distinctive) buttons, bits of clothing, wood-carvings, shoes, etc.

So basically, you're not just being asked to believe that "Vikings" made the journey, you're being asked to believe that they made a journey which is completely uncharacteristic, picked up every last bit of their trash along the way and packed it out in a way they NEVER did, and that they left their dead behind to the tender mercies of enemies that they pissed off, but somehow fail to have any records of themselves prior to the 1890s. That would be like being asked to believe that you made a car trip halfway across the country, ran over somebody's dog, and drove all the way back without ever stopping for gas, being caught on a camera anywhere, and with the owner of the dog not talking about his dog dying until somebody twenty years later shows a drawing they did "that night." It's not IMPOSSIBLE....but it is VERY highly unlikely.

So all most people are saying about this is, "Nice drawing. Where's the dog buried?" We want more, and so far, nobody can give it.

Americanegro

1/8/2018 09:43:18 pm

Vikings did do some exploring as evidenced by the settlement(s?) in Greenland. It seems the story is they came to North America without pottery or metal solely to bury a stone carving and get busy inseminating the locals. That's why they needed to bring the Cistercians, because celibate monks make the best inseminators.

What's the first thing you do when you find 10 of your buddies dead? Get yourself a 200 and some pound rock and set to carving. This is the Beverly Hillbillies version of the Vikings.

Only Me

1/6/2018 06:37:38 pm

I read Wolter's quote and I'm amazed he thinks willfully ignoring the objections raised by experts is "addressing" them.

What "tidal wave of facts" has been presented when he refers to his own work, in his own paper, on his own blog, as "speculative research"?

Yes, it is sad. It is sad that a delusional crank and his supporters truly believe an ever-changing pre-Columbian fantasy can replace factual history.

DPBROKAW

1/6/2018 10:56:03 pm

Don’t forget “his own peer review”!

Luke

1/6/2018 06:40:42 pm

I live in Minnesota and remember my dad brought me to the 'museum' where either the runestone or a replica of it was kept over 20 years ago. I have vague memories of displays showing what life was like for the Norsemen who 'originally colonized North America'. It's a shame that the state I love would pay money to endorse a 19th century fraud.

E.P. Grondine

1/8/2018 09:51:59 am

Hi Luke -

Since you are in Minnesota now, you know the winter weather there. I suppose that Roswell has its UFO museum, and now Kennsington has its runestone museum. Given the sledding hill, the mountain bike paths, the horse trails, what these folks paid for was a two for one: museum and recreational park.

Not too bad a deal, and given the lack of other things to do in the area, and the really crappy weather, not bad at all.
A million today is not what it used to be.

I suppose someday Duluth will have a Bob Dylan childhood home museum; it would be nice if that huge mound at the west end of Lake Superior was better known. There will be that Prince museum in Minneapolis-St Paul as well. Not enough to make people move there, but enough for entertainment.

1/7/2018 03:02:23 pm

It is funny how certain he is this thing is real. In the last ten years I have been watching what he has been doing he steadfastly refuses to even look at any information that does not support his "thesis." I mean he is a trained geologist who rejects academia as a conspiracy in order to make money. Sorry Scott "Three strikes and you're out!" I have never seen anyone so wrong promote how right they are. Actually the whole thing kind of stinks with hidden political overtones possibly.

D.Knox

1/7/2018 05:17:21 pm

It's nice to know that some people have little more to do than poop on somebody's parade. Just because Scott Wolter doesn't have a piece of paper from a "higher" learning institution hanging on his wall in some stuffy study, doesn't mean he doesn't know his rear from a hole in the ground. Anybody can study and learn about this stuff - it's not rocket science - but instead of THAT path, you choose to besmirch the guy and puff yourselves up with importance. Who stuck a bee in your bonnets? Only a pompous hypocrite goes around trying to begrudge another person of their accomplishments. The shows he did were interesting and it mattered little that he wasn't up to his neck in credentials, which I'm sure is a real burr under the saddle for those who overspent to attend the finest universities, but not Scott Wolter's problem. Do humanity a favor: Find something better to do with your time instead of looking down your self-important, up-turned noses at everybody else.

Americanegro

1/7/2018 05:41:20 pm

"Just because Scott Wolter doesn't have a piece of paper from a "higher" learning institution hanging on his wall in some stuffy study, doesn't mean he doesn't know his rear from a hole in the ground." Then why did he claim a degree on his resume that he was never awarded?

I must have watched a different TV show from you. The argument is that there are no accomplishments. There's no begrudging going on. You sound like you could use a cup of coffee.

Jim

1/7/2018 06:56:29 pm

D.Knox,, " Anybody can study and learn about this stuff - it's not rocket science "
Well, lets look at that shall we. Wolter claims to be right and the Scandinavian linguists wrong. As far as I know Wolter is not fluent in any Scandinavian language. How can he know more than the scholars when he knows nothing ?
One can't claim to be a chess-master if you don't even know the rules.

" Scott Wolter doesn’t read any Scandinavian language. He doesn’t know any Scandinavian history. "
Richard Nielsen.

http://www.minnesotamonthly.com/December-2011/Runestone-Cowboy/

An Over-Educated Grunt

1/7/2018 08:40:03 pm

Funny enough, even where he is professionally qualified on paper, he's shown himself either to be grossly incompetent or a venal fraud. If you're unfamiliar with his professional work as a geologist, I suggest you look into his work with Lake Superior agates, which included a judge deciding he'd either proven himself incompetent or a fraud - on a subject he'd published on.

1/8/2018 09:12:21 pm

No, he doesn't know his rear from a hole in the ground because he hasn't bothered to actually study and learn. Yes, I AM going to take the word of the guy with the paper on the wall, because that paper certifies that he spent at least four goddamn years studying this shit, and didn't just use Google Translate. And when there are a LOT of people with the SAME piece of paper saying the SAME thing, I am DEFINITELY not going to take the word of the guy who spent ten minutes on Google! I don't begrudge the man "his accomplishments," I begrudge the fact that he is spreading LIES and SLANDERING people who DO know better than he does. That's what's known as a liar and a cheat, sir, not someone to be RESPECTED.

Do humanity a favor: become one. Learn something. We have too many people who are refusing to use the one thing that gives our species an advantage--our BRAINS--and I don't feel like being replaced by some other species.

Jim

1/8/2018 12:00:18 am

From Wolters Blog

http://scottwolteranswers.blogspot.ca/2018/01/kensington-rune-stone-visitors-center.html

Anonymous,,,,"Is the hooked x have anything to do with genetics, like the xy gene or a regular x gene?"

Wolter,,,"This idea has been proposed before and there could very well be something to it."

Joe Scales

1/8/2018 11:19:30 am

You beat me to it Jim. Didn't see your post before offering this gem up as well below.

Chevy

1/8/2018 08:50:01 am

Scott Wolter is kind of a Labrador Retriever kind of guy who expects us to believe fairy tales concocted by himself. The KRS is a sham of a lie wrapped up in a questionable enigma. And he states this as fact that he has empirically proven to be true. Total and complete idiot that is not even trained how to analyze cultural phenomena. Its peer reviewed after all. Since he has become a Freemason maybe he will recognize that some of his bro's left this there in the nineteenth century for him to contemplate. Dude was punked and owned by the history channel.

Joe Scales

1/8/2018 11:16:13 am

Again, Wolter rewards his fans with some amazing blundering. This time, it's about chromosomes (from his blog):

"Anonymous January 7, 2018 at 5:57 PM

Is the hooked x have anything to do with genetics, like the xy gene or a regular x gene?"

"Scott Wolter January 7, 2018 at 6:18 PM

This idea has been proposed before and there could very well be something to it. Like all symbols in Freemasonry and Templarism, they have multiple meanings. This could be one of them."

So now Templars are conducting gene research about five hundred years before anyone else in discovering the Hooked X Chromosome (®). It just doesn't get any better than this.

Machala

1/8/2018 11:51:34 am

If this weren't so real, I'd have thought that this whole ridiculous farce was something dreamed up by Garrison Keillor for Prairie Home Companion.Obviously, the good folks of Kensington are doing this with their tongues firmly planted in their cheeks or they're even more gullible and bizarre than the denizens of Lake Wobegon !
At least Keillor's fiction was entertaining. Wolter's is nothing but tedious. The whole KRS fiasco is a sad tale of gullibility and desperate desire on the part of many Minnesotans to inflate their Norse heritage beyond the realms of credibility.
I will say, that I don't even think Garrison Keillor could come up with the name B. Bonk for the Park Superintendent character !

Doc Rock

1/9/2018 02:14:15 am

It's really quite amazing. The Minoans mined thousands of tons of copper out of the Great Lakes region 3000 years ago. The Phoenicians landed in the Carolinas not long afterward. The Lost Tribes of Israel battled it out from one end of north America to the other 2500 years ago. Graeco-Egyptians settled southern Illinois and the Wabash Valley 2000 years ago. Knights Templar were in New England 800 years ago. The Vikings were all over Minnesota 700 years ago. Am sure that I have left out several other groups from throughout the world that planted their respective flags in pre-Columbian Yet not a single authenticated provenienced artifact associated with any of these groups has been recovered and virtually no professional scholars with training in the specific relevant fields buy into these narratives. The conspiracy to cover all this up and delude us into thinking that it is utter nonsense must be a vast one indeed.

E.P. Grondine

1/9/2018 11:31:11 am

And there are no Native Americans in all of that.

It is an interesting phenomena, and if you are looking for solutions to the conundrum, then I suggest that you look at the archaeologists/ethnologists treating the Native American oral corpus as "trash".

To my knowledge, you can count on your fingers and toes those who do not.

Another explanation is that archaeologists are crappy writers, who can not make their sites interesting to the general public.
How many people know much of anything about the Native peoples of Minnesota?

Essentially, what is going on is cultural genocide, following the physical genocide.

The fault may lie not in the stars, but in yourselves. You simply have left the people out of your site reports, and others have stepped in with their own remarkable ravings.

Doc Rock

1/9/2018 01:26:32 pm

You do realize that there are now more than a few Native Americans who are working as professional cultural anthropologists and archaeologists. I've been in anthropology for over 30 years and have never encountered anthropologists who treated Native American oral traditions as "trash." In fact, some archaeologists make heavy use of Native American oral traditions to help interpret archaeological materials. There is a journal called Public Archaeology which was specifically developed to provide outreach to the broader public on the field of archaeology in a style that is more accessible than dry site reports. Various archaeological societies do a lot of forms of outreach to educate the public and regularly cooperate with Native American groups in regards to research on Native Americans. You may be able to draw upon some old or rare examples to support your assertions, but for the most part you are way off base..

Amnericanegro

1/9/2018 02:00:12 pm

Me blame heapum firewater.

William M Smith

1/9/2018 03:46:36 pm

Attached is a link to the Native American who took a stone canoe west to east on Lake Ontario to advise the 5 nations the new laws of the land. Evidence points to this taking place in 1472 in a small fishing tender boat which was part of the KRS crew. This small canoe with stone ballast and a small sail would look like the one carved in stone at Copper Harbor, Mich. Pull up the proper photo of the site and you may even see a triangle stone hole. By the way the THOR group has members which are Native American Indian and very familiar with their legends and history. http://www.onondaganation.org/news/video/2008/the-stone-canoe-the-story-of-the-peace-maker-2/

Americanegro

1/9/2018 06:44:21 pm

"Attached is a link to the Native American who took a stone canoe west to east on Lake Ontario to advise the 5 nations the new laws of the land."

Should read "Attached is a link to a Youtube video made by 4th graders."

https://www.publishersweekly.com/978-0-684-80094-3

"According to Iroquois legend, a son born of a virgin mother carved a canoe from a block of white granite and, traveling the shores of Lake Ontario, convinced five feuding tribes to lay down their arms and join together as the Iroquois Confederacy. The boat's ability to float was proof to the chieftains that the youth was a divine messenger."

In other words they admit that a stone canoe wouldn't float. The idea of stone ballast in a stone canoe is risible.

You never fail to disappoint. Take note of the use of paragraphs.

Americanegro

1/9/2018 11:47:43 pm

Did you ever get around to reading David (an actual Injun) Cusick's 1828 publication? "[L]ikely the earliest account of Native American folklore to be written and published in English by a Native American author."

https://blogs.princeton.edu/westernamericana/2013/11/25/david-cusicks-sketches-of-ancient-history-of-the-six-nations/

Remember you're still on the hook to explain what the "Stony Giants"'s "pointing device" was.

E.P. Grondine

1/10/2018 10:16:19 am

Hi Doc -

I stand by my comments.

If you look at the Society for Historical Archaeology, it starts with European contact.

Native oral histories are generally ignored, and the amount of modern ethnographic work is very small.

I would like to add that here in Ohio, the absolute history of the movement of the Shawnee during the "Beaver Wars" is generally ignored, leading to a massive amount of nonsense. As far as ethnographic work goes, it stopped with Erminie Vogelin many decades ago, and her work has generalky been ignored since then.

The best work in this area is now done by European archaeologists, and I am hoping for more of them to show up.

In general, most archaeologists do not know how to present "their" sites to the public. If they did, there would not be so many "mysteries" for these conmen to exploit.

Now if you look at a great archaeologist like Bill Kelso, he sees that his sites are presented to the public. Mos archaeologists do not know how to do this, and are completely incapable of doing it themselves. You end up with sites with no people.

Doc Rock

1/10/2018 12:22:08 pm

E.P.

And I stand by mine. Anyone interested who cares to put a little time and effort into looking into these issues in depth can easily determine who is standing on firmer ground.

E.P. Grondine

1/10/2018 12:32:20 pm

Hi Doc (again) -

I would be remiss not to mention and recognize the excellent work being done at the University of Tennessee Knoxville in training young Native American archaeologists. I have great hopes for seeing very excellent work from them in the future.

In the meantime, while you may grade students, I rely on the work of archaeologists (among others) for work in my own field, and I grade archaeologists. While there are great ones, too many here are pretty poor by international standards.

Doc Rock

1/10/2018 12:53:26 pm

Your original "fingers and toes" and "trash" position seems to be evolving unless the only anthropologists (white or Native American) doing any sort of good work are now only to be found at Tennessee. I would suggest checking around a bit more. And with a little more effort you could probably figure out why historical archaeologists are interested primarily in the post-contact era.

I should add that I have lectured on the Beaver Wars at several schools and know of a number of scholars who have investigated the issues associated with it that you claim are ignored. But won't go into it here because I suspect that you are more interested in trying lure people down your rabbit hole than attempting an informed discussion.

But I wish you luck with your particular unique interests.

E.P. Grondine

1/10/2018 08:39:37 pm

Hi Doc -

I have met great archaeologists, its just that I have met so many really bad ones.

Glad to here you are working on the "Beaver Wars". When you get to the Puritan gun trade, let me know.

Having a beverage this evening?:
https://youtu.be/A3MGfJ3eMGA
remember to line up a friend or a taxi.

William M Smith

1/10/2018 04:20:53 pm

Doc Rock - The Vikings 700 years ago???? They ended in 1005 according to the expert Archaeologist and Anthropologist.
It was the Native American grave site protection laws passed by white men in the 1990s that made in most states the need for a native archaeologist to represent his tribe to insure the history and preservation of ancient sites are protected. Joe Shoemaker is a Native American archaeologist we have in our area of Ohio.
When Squire and Davis recorded the 5,000 mounds and sites in Ohio, it only took 200 years for the modern europeans to reduce this number to less than 500.
Templars in America??? You have been watching to much History Chanel. Egyptians in America??? Lost tribes of Israel??? Where is the DNA ?
Do you provide academic proof of factual evidence at your lectures?

Doc Rock

1/10/2018 05:46:27 pm

At this point the only thing preventing me from completely surrendering to despair and reaching for that box of rat poison under the sink is that you managed, albeit in clumsy fashion, to name drop Squier (note the spelling) and Davis and you recognized the existence of at least one Native American anthropologist. So, instead of ending the intellectual agony tonite, I am going to drink myself into a stupor, get a good nights sleep, and then try to convince myself tomorrow that I never had any interaction with either you or E.P. .

Joe Scales

1/9/2018 11:41:29 am

Wolter often goes on about the "dotted R" being the smoking gun for authenticity of the KRS. What's interesting to note, is that if it were in fact a true "dotted R" and not one of the many blemishes that pepper the stone, he might be on to something. However, in true Wolter fashion, he takes a possibility and turns it into a certainty. Fact is, it would not only have to be an intentional "dotted R", but it would have to fit within grammatical context for medieval Swedish runes. This latter point is of course wholly ignored by Wolter, who like a dog, only responds to certain key buzz words in his quest to legitimize the KRS. I'm sure Professor Henrik Williams, at one point tried to explain these nuances to Wolter, but was of course insulted and defamed in return. All Wolter wanted to hear was that a "dotted R" meant medieval, and he was good to go.

For an easy read on this topic, see the paper Professor Williams wrote, linked below. In summary, though the "dotted R's" on the KRS were likely either unintentional, or solely decorative, their use wouldn't make grammatical sense given the words for which they appear.

http://www.nordiska.uu.se/digitalAssets/79/a_79636-f_dotted-runes.pdf

Clete

1/9/2018 12:26:58 pm

As long as some of the contributors to this blog are bashing Scott Wolter, I will add my bit. Didn't he a few years ago preform a "Test" on the Kensington Rune Stone which partially ruined it for further testing. Maybe it should be renamed The Kensington Ruined Stone.

Joe Scales

1/9/2018 01:26:57 pm

Wolter had a molding done on the KRS some time ago, I suppose in order to replicate it. The chemical compounds left a dark stain on the entire rock. Reports verifying the damage were done by Professor Paul Weiblen (2008) and Richard Nielsen (2010). Harold Edwards also verified that it had been stained, and as I recall, when he first saw the KRS it reminded him of New York bluestone; the sort of rocks folks back in the 1800's would use for walkways and such prior to the production of concrete. After it was stained, this resemblance was gone.

Jim

1/9/2018 01:27:50 pm

Clete, do you have any links etc about this ? I have heard it mentioned but have never run across anything about it. Thanks.

Joe Scales

1/9/2018 01:46:01 pm

Here's Professor Weiblen's report from 2008 which provides great detail to what actually happened. Wolter of course denies the rock was ever stained.

https://websites.godaddy.com/blob/65151a46-8ee3-453c-83d3-7b1077c69c9e/downloads/1bjjqskll_883107.pdf?fb4c336b

Jim

1/9/2018 03:17:02 pm

Thanks, good stuff there, I find this sentence particularly interesting.

"I am of the same mind as Winchell who concluded that study of physical aspects of the KRS will probably not contribute much to establishing the authenticity of the runes."

Does not Scott "Fear the Peer" Wolter use Winchell's work as evidence for authenticity ? Seems Winchell would not agree with Wolter.

Joe Scales

1/9/2018 04:08:03 pm

To be fair, Winchell believed the KRS to be authentic, but his opinion was mostly based on believing witnesses he interviewed about a decade after initial discovery, not his science which was often contradictory. In fact, he was the one who first opined that the stone must have fallen face down soon after carving for the runes cut in calcite to look so fresh (which all runes appeared to be, according to his initial findings). This of course is not how science works. Yet Wolter follows in Winchell's footsteps as well, in working backwards from the conclusion the KRS is authentic. As a point of interest, many of those aforementioned witness accounts were translated for him by none other than Hjalmar Holland, the first commercial promoter for the rock.

You should seek out Winchell's committee report to the Minnesota Historical Society online. In the end, though he believed in authenticity, he deferred to the Swedish linguists whose opinions led the MHS to reject authenticity.

Joe Scales

1/11/2018 03:51:41 pm

For another hoax Winchell bought into, check out the Paleoliths of Kansas debacle:

https://websites.godaddy.com/blob/65151a46-8ee3-453c-83d3-7b1077c69c9e/downloads/1bjjr6obu_569241.pdf?9c852de9

Americanegro

1/9/2018 02:01:30 pm

Don't forget the core sample he took from the back of the stone. I believe he never said he was authorized to do that.

Scott Wolter is an idiot.

Joe Scales

1/9/2018 04:16:47 pm

My guess would be that Wolter kept that core sample as a sort of trophy, showing it off at dinner parties and such. Doubt you'll ever see it without an invite, as it would also stand as evidence against his denial for staining the slab. Unless of course he makes a rubber mold of it too...

Americanegro

1/9/2018 05:00:01 pm

In the paper you cited above the author says the core sample, roughly one inch in diameter and one inch long, was sectioned and implies doubts about the chain of custody of the outer section.

It wouldn't take a long time to read it.

Joe Scales

1/9/2018 07:56:13 pm

"It wouldn't take a long time to read it."

Then maybe you should read it again.

Americanegro

1/9/2018 08:39:26 pm

"Then maybe you should read it again."

FACE!

"The discussion that
followed led to the decision to take a one inch diameter core from the back side of the KRS. The
bifurcation in the bleached trace was chosen as the site from which Scott Wolter would core a
plug. For the initial study of the plug, I believe Professor Ojkangas agreed to make a petrographic
description and I volunteered to characterize the mineralogy with electron microprobe (EMP)
analyses. I indicated that I would volunteer my time, but the Department of Geology and
Geophysics at the University of Minnesota would have to be reimbursed for the EMP analyses.
Subsequently, Scott Wolter and I discussed ways to section the one inch diameter by ~ one inch
long plug. We worked out a protocol for transferring the plug and any petrograghic sections made
from it. I created a form which would provide a signed document of materials transferred.
Upon completing some EMP analyses I wrote a preliminary report for Barry Hanson. My wife
and I took the report to Scott Wolter's home and left it with him in a manila envelope addressed
to Barry Hanson (I understand Scott did not give this report to Barry Hanson at the April, 2002
meeting of the Museum Board, (the minutes should reflect those in attendance).
After I gave a final report to Barry Hanson, I returned the materials I had used in my studies to
Scott Wolter (a copy of the transfer document is attached). Subsequently, the Department of
Geology and Geophysics at the University of Minnesota was paid $1,200 by Dick Nielsen for EMP analysis."

"As noted above in the fifth paragraph on page 2, the weathered surface on the cored plug is now
the only surface area of the KRS that has not been contaminated by the recent molding process.
The unstained cored plug is invaluable because future techniques might become available that
would make it possible to resolve time differences between the weathered patina in the runes
compared to the patina on the rest of the KRS (older) surface. For this reason it is crucial that
there be in place a protocol for research on the cored plug and a documented chain of custody."

Joe Scales

1/10/2018 10:33:37 am

What, you still don't understand it? Perhaps you should go back to bantering with the lunatics above. You're better suited for it.

Americanegro

1/10/2018 11:34:47 am

"JOE SCALES
1/9/2018 04:16:47 pm
My guess would be that Wolter kept that core sample as a sort of trophy, showing it off at dinner parties and such. Doubt you'll ever see it without an invite, as it would also stand as evidence against his denial for staining the slab. Unless of course he makes a rubber mold of it too..."

Joe Scales

1/10/2018 01:09:18 pm

1) It was a guess, somewhat in jest.
2) You have no idea how the original plug was sectioned.
3) That Weiblen still referred to it as "The unstained cored plug" after discussing what he'd done with at least a part of it would seem to me to infer much of it is intact.
4) Weiblen recommends that a chain of custody be kept. Unlike you, I don't necessarily take this as implying "doubts about the chain of custody of the outer section." See also #2 above.
5) Wolter has admitted to having possession of the plug in question. Ask him yourself, if you'd like.

Americanegro

1/10/2018 01:39:05 pm

https://websites.godaddy.com/blob/65151a46-8ee3-453c-83d3-7b1077c69c9e/downloads/1bjjr2j2i_6396.pdf?1990c761

See pp. 19-24 for your daily dose of...

FACE!

Joe Scales

1/10/2018 03:48:37 pm

Thanks for that. I suppose I should have said that you wouldn't know the particulars of the sectioning from the article I provided that you took issue with. But I'm not above having it handed to me on occasion. Well played sir.

Americanegro

1/10/2018 04:42:34 pm

We cool.

Gunn At Risk

1/10/2018 11:35:04 am

If I recall correctly, both Winchell and Holand noticed that the topography at Runestone Park had changed over the centuries. Specifically, they saw that the elevation of water had changed, due to a slowly-eroding ravine, where there is now a paved road going over the spot. The clear implication to both men was that Runestone Hill was once surrounded by a lot more water than in these modern times. (I'm not supporting the idea of mooring stones!) This is likey why the inscription on the KRS reads "peninsula-island," or sometimes "island," depending on the translation.

What this indicates to me is that Runestone Hill was most likely a moat-like defensive camping spot at the east end of a ridge-line, that was previously known about. The KRS party may have gone to that spot that they already knew about, and that was already marked up with stonehole rocks. In other words, I tend to support the notion that the stonehole rocks surrounding Runestone Hill may have pre-existed the placing of the KRS as a memorial stone. In theory, they placed the memorial stone on Runestone Hill because they figured Scandinavians would be coming back that way in the future, as a defensive camping spot.

The proposed site of the ill-fated camping spot a day's travel north of Runestone Park was a poor place to camp, though the men probably thought they were safe because they were well off the Chippewa River, camped on the slightly elevated west bank of Davidson Lake, where the Erdahl Ax was found in 1894 a foot and a half down under a tree stump two feet across. This spot is next to a pool of spring water. Davidson Lake, as I discovered, currently has two "skerries," or small rockly islands, though I think slightly higher water back then (lakes eroding into lakes on the way down to the Chippewa River) probably would have presented better, more noticeable examples back in 1362. They should have made camp late and broke camp early, in hindsight. Google "Crow Creek" to see what the men probably endured, being "red with blood."

A day's travel down the Chippew River from Runestone Hill, one may see the remains of a sconce, which is a word describing something I found a few years ago, also on the east side of the Chippewa River just a few miles (to avoid smoke and noise): a rocky defensive lookout shelter. This may very well be Norse and medieval. So, I'm saying I think these roving Norsemen likely had known defensive camping spots along the routes of some of their explorations. I hypothesize that between the sconce and the discharge of the Chippew River, there may be another defensive camping spot a few miles east of the river, splitting two days' travel in half.

But, let's not get overly excited...this is only logical speculation. I hope to make a few photos of the sconce publicly available soon. Oddly enough, it seems to be sporting a flat-faced, pyramid-shaped rock....

Peace from the fringe.

Robin Masters

1/10/2018 12:38:10 pm

He took the bait!

AnonymousJanuary 8, 2018 at 10:08 AM
Speaking of symbols, what do you think of the shot of a Cross of Lorraine ring at the end the Magnum P.I. credits?

http://magnum-mania.com/Articles/The_Team_Ring.html

Scott WolterJanuary 10, 2018 at 7:01 AM
I think that Cross of Lorraine ring is very cool. Hard to know if it's a Catholic thing or if they are true initiates. Both will recognize and appreciate the symbol even if they interpret its meaning completely differently.

Gunn At Risk

1/11/2018 12:19:23 pm

I thought I might take a risk here while the subject of the KRS is wide open and try to explain why I think post-Templars may have been involved with the Kensington Runestone. Simply put, it is because at one time the Catholic Church and the Knights Templar we attached at the hip...before their nasty breakup in the early 14th century.

However, to say that actual Templars had anything to do with the KRS is wrong, since there were no Templars around in 1362 (with the exception of a few very old men.) But, if Runestone Hill pre-existed 1362 as a known camping site or for another unknown reason, any exploring parties may have included Templars accompanying the Catholic Church in its proposed pursuit of new, faraway lands--which was once a very popular idea before disease and colder climatic conditions caused a dry-up of interest, and follow-through.

It is possible that follow-through came in 1362, with "remnants" (relatives) of the Templars involved, though I'm not advocating that this did happen. However, I do see a certain amount of correlation between the Newport Tower, the Sauk Lake Altar Rock and the KRS, in that each can be described as having been created by Christians far away from their homeland.

We can see this trifecta of corroborations in the three icons themselves. The Newport Tower is likely a Swedish-style round church (Holand), with a previous altar in place, the Sauk Lake Altar Rock seems to have been adaptable to Catholic specifications for an altar and canopy (Holand), and the KRS has as part of its inscription, "AVM," which also connotates Catholicism. Two of these examples of medieval Scandinavian Christianity here in MN are accompanied by medieval stoneholes, which are characteristic of Scandinavia.

So, in my view, it is quite possible that post-Templar representatives may have accompanied the KRS party to Runestone Hill, especially if Runestone Hill was known about by the Church and marked up well before 1362. Though many or most of the medieval petroglyphs and stoneholes by the MN/Dakota border may have been created by other Norse interests (besides the Church; for furs, for instance) a hundred or two hundred years previous to the KRS expedition, they cannot be discounted as having been made by medieval European Catholics, accompanied by muscle, in the same way that these three mentioned national icons might have been.

I propose, along with others, that the Catholic Church was well aware of even the most secretive mapping outreaches during their days of sharing power with the Knights Templar. The big question seems to be, was the KRS party interested in resuming the fur trade, or were looking to acquire or re-aquire something else?

Americanegro

1/11/2018 02:48:47 pm

Wow. You really will say anything won't you?

There WERE no Templars in 1362. Learn it. Know it. Live it.

The Catholic Church was not an exploring enterprise. Learn it. Know it. Live it.

"The Newport Tower is likely a Swedish-style round church (Holand), with a previous altar in place" We've seen a picture of a contemporaneous English windmill that looks a lot like the Newport Tower. How about you show us a picture of a "Swedish-style round church (Holand), with a previous altar in place" that looks the same.

I note, not for the first time, that we have no contemporaneous accounts from English settlers about "Wow! There's a bitchin' tower here!"

"I propose, along with others, that the Catholic Church was well aware of even the most secretive mapping outreaches during their days of sharing power with the Knights Templar."

Ah yes. Big Church, Big Smithsonian, Big Academia. Ever notice that there's no Small Oil or Small Pharma?

Jim

1/11/2018 03:52:06 pm

Right there we have proof that Wolters method of repeating nonsense ad nauseam works.

William M Smith

1/11/2018 05:34:59 pm

Gunn - You are correct about the KRS and Newport Tower having a Templar contact, however you will find the connection is through the Portuguese and Denmark with a group called Knights of Christ. Unlike France they were not among the group rounded up and killed.
The Newport Tower and KRS are mentioned in the Spain and Portugal 1494 treaty. Three carbon dates support 1472 as the build date of the tower and also the zero magnetic declination line of the KRS. The triangle stone builders mark at the top of the tower is also 17 degrees west of true north in order to identify the date of build by the builder placing his stone.

Americanegro

1/11/2018 08:38:06 pm

"The Newport Tower and KRS are mentioned in the Spain and Portugal 1494 treaty."

NO THEY ARE NOT YOU MENTAL PATIENT.

William M Smith

1/11/2018 10:07:21 pm

Chapter 3 in the Portuguese translation. Of course you must understand the use of the lodestone compass to understand longitude lines were isometric magnetic lines that went from pole to pole. The magnetic line at Cape Verde ended up at Newport and was 17 degrees west on the compass at all locations on that line. Called a pole line. The land claim stated a marker 370 leagues west of this pole line would mark the west pole line. This just happens to be at Kensington in 1472. In 1362 it was 65 miles west of its 1472 location, however the carver and placement of the KRS maintained the 1362 date because they were under the rule of the two kings and the kings mothers were sisters. Please explain your proof the tower is not mentioned in the treaty as well as the 370 leagues between the two magnetic pole lines. I think it would be more scientific than your calling the messenger a Mental Patient. My name is William M Smith, Did your mother name you AMERICANEGRO

Jim

1/12/2018 12:04:20 am

Willy Boy,,,," The magnetic line at Cape Verde ended up at Newport and was 17 degrees west on the compass at all locations on that line. "

How do you explain the fact that a line drawn on google earth from Cape Verde to Newport shows a 312 degree bearing, or 48 degrees west of true north ?

Americanegro

1/12/2018 08:51:04 am

NO I DON'T "MUST UNDERSTAND" YOU MENTAL PATIENT.

William M Smith

1/12/2018 10:46:45 am

Jim - You seem to lack the understanding of the words (Isometric line) (Magnetic declination) and (Magnetic declination drift to the east at about 50 miles per 100 years) When the Newport Tower was built in 1472 the magnet declination was 17 degrees west, today this is less than 15 degrees west. At the same time in 1472 Cape Verde was 17 degrees west. The longitude lines you are talking about were not measurable in 1472 with tools of the day. The only tool used to measure longitude was the reading of the difference between true north and magnetic north. Cape Verde and Newport read the same and 370 leagues west of this line was another isometric magnetic declination line that represented the west boundary of their land claim. This west line includes the KRS. You also seem to miss-spell William, Jimmy Boy.

William M Smith

1/12/2018 11:51:53 am

Also keep in mind that the 1494 treaty states that at the first contact to new land (Newport Tower) A line will be drawn north and south to determine the east boundary and a line will be drawn 370 leagues west of this line to represent the west boundary. NOTE: The west north and south line established at the KRS site was a point of intersection of the zero magnetic declination. This line represented the North Pole line which by order of the kings limited the land claim to the west.

Jim

1/12/2018 11:54:24 am

I lack understanding ? hahahaha, what you just said is just babble ! You just said Cape Verde and Newport were on the same line of longitude !!!
You have been arguing for years that they could measure longitude back then. You said the vikings could measure longitude with your fictitious lunar compass ! You told me they could measure longitude using a compass and a sundial.,,,, now you say this ,,"The longitude lines you are talking about were not measurable in 1472 with tools of the day."
Do you even understand longitude ? Here is a hint, longitude has absolutely nothing to do with magnetic declination !
Get your shit together !

Jim

1/12/2018 11:57:46 am

"Also keep in mind that the 1494 treaty states that at the first contact to new land (Newport Tower) A line will be drawn north and south to determine the east boundary and a line will be drawn 370 leagues west of this line to represent the west boundary. "

The treaty says no such thing, learn how to read !!

Americanegro

1/12/2018 02:17:52 pm

MENTAL PATIENT.

Americanegro

1/12/2018 02:36:04 pm

So when someone points out the obvious truth that "William M Smith is wrong, delusional and a MENTAL PATIENT" they "lack understanding"?

Jim

1/11/2018 07:07:33 pm

Groundhog day

Mike Morgan

1/21/2018 05:25:44 am

OOOOH, OUCH! Scott Wolter got SCHOOOOOLED .... sort of.

A clipped portion of his reply on January 17, 2018 at 9:26 AM to a comment under his blog post on Thursday, January 4, 2018 "Kensington Rune Stone Visitors Center is Officially Open", Scott said,

"The Kensington Rune Stone is just one of many controversial artifacts that demand a huge rewrite of the historical narrative. It will not come unless academia, and by extension the Smithsonian, are forced to do the right thing. IT WILL HAPPEN WHEN ENOUGH PEOPLE SPEAK UP AND DEMAND THE TRUTH BE TOLD AND THREATEN TO STOP MAKING FINANCIAL DONATIONS TO THE ACADEMIC INSTITUTIONS WHERE THESE IDIOTS RESIDE. THE THREAT OF POSSIBLY LOSING THEIR TENURE AND/OR FUNDING FOR THEIR PET PROJECTS WILL BEGIN TO SLOW, AND EVENTUALLY TURN THE SHIP AROUND. (Emphasis mine.)

To which Anonymous replied on January 17, 2018 at 10:46 PM
"Scott,

Even with your degree it's like you don't understand how academia works. The whole point of tenure is you don't lose tenure and colleges don't depend on donations. Harvard, for instance could admit everyone free forever and still have money left over for ballet or whatever. Now grants are another thing but you've got to be able to deliver something. I've been living on grants off and on since I was fifteen. And there was a lot of off time but it didn't change my behavior."
Cheers, .... (I withheld name.)

Stealing from Americanegro, Scott Wolter is an idiot.

Jim

1/21/2018 08:20:58 pm

Unfortunately, you can school Wolter till the cows come home, it just doesn't take. It"s fun trying though.

Jim

1/22/2018 12:42:36 pm

Wolter ,,,
"Of course not silly, there is no credible pushback against the KRS inscription today."

"The facts are in and the KRS case is solved"

" I'm just thrilled for the Ohman Family, and the world, that things are going in the right direction as science is prevailing over dogma."

It's amazing, Wolter thinks that because he has become irrelevant and the experts ignore his nonsense, he is winning some battle against academia.

William M Smith

1/22/2018 01:31:50 pm

Wolter - You have to be kidding - No pushback against the KRS inscription today???? What about the word (DEAD) on the KRS that has been translated and proven for the time period that this word is (DEATH) by David Johnson. This new confirmed translation is pushback and has a dramatic change in the translation as meant by the carver.
You have to be kidding - The facts are in and the KRS case is closed - You are not qualified to close it because you are wrong in many cases and have been proven so by other academics. Example: Dick Neilson made a strong case against your dotted R that you had to have to prove your code. The ground line has mechanical wear that could not exist if the carver buried the stone and marked it's location with mooring stone holes. You made a strong case that all the local stokeholes were made to locate the KRS. It was your improper mold casting that turned many academics away.
You got to be kidding - You are thrilled because the Ohman Family and the world, feels things are going in the right direction as science is prevailing over dogma. This is proof you live in another world than I.