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Greg Little Tries to Rehabilitate Grand Canyon Hoax

9/14/2014

37 Comments

 
Dr. Greg Little has released yet another article attacking me for his own version of what he thinks I said. Little, who has attempted to debunk my analysis of the development of the ancient astronaut theory as well as the alleged Smithsonian conspiracy to suppress the existence of giants, has now attacked me for concluding that the 1909 Arizona Gazette article asserting the existence of a Tibetan-Egyptian civilization beneath the Grand Canyon is not true. Little claims that in his newest article he will refute me by (a) demonstrating that the article is based on facts and (b) showing that I am wrong about David Childress’s role in developing the idea that the Smithsonian was involved in a conspiracy.
I will leave aside Little’s repeated and barbed attacks against me to focus on the facts.

The April 1909 Arizona Gazette article made a number of assertions. The major assertions are as follows:

  • In 1909 an explorer named G. E. Kinkaid, the first white person born in Idaho, made a rafting trip down the Colorado River. He spotted stains on rock wall in the Grand Canyon and climbed up to a rock shelf, discovering a cave on government land.
  • Kinkaid worked for the Smithsonian for thirty years.
  • Kinkaid entered the cave and found an underground citadel full of “Oriental” artifacts with room for 50,000 inhabitants, who were of ancient Asian origin.
  • Prof. S. A. Jordan of the Smithsonian directed excavations “several months” after Kinkaid found the cave, discovering a larger underground complex nearly a mile below the surface.

Little believes that the story is true for a number of reasons, which I will annotate with reasons why he is wrong:

  • An ichthyologist and eugenicist named David Starr Jordan “was associated with” the Smithsonian for thirty years. Therefore Little believes “S. A. Jordan” was real. David Starr Jordan did not work for the Smithsonian and was in fact the founding president of Stanford University, the position he held in 1909—when he was pointedly not excavating Egyptians in Arizona. His papers and news accounts show he was at Stanford in 1908 and 1909, and in February of 1909—when he was supposedly excavating mummies—he was actually giving a speech at the Unitarian Club of San Francisco in honor of Charles Darwin. (Jordan, in fact, wrote a piece in 1906 expressing his wonder at the ancient astronaut theory, which he wrongly believed to be an ancient Hindu doctrine.)
  • David Starr Jordan journeyed down the Colorado River in 1896, so therefore Little believes the newspaper is correct that G. E. Kinkaid did so in 1909. This makes no logical sense.
  • Because David Starr Jordan, signing his name as Prof. Jordan, wrote reports for the Smithsonian, the Smithsonian is lying when it claims it has no records of S. A. Jordan in its Dept. of Anthropology. David Starr Jordan wrote about fossils and fish and was not associated with the Dept. of Anthropology. His name, of course, is not S. A. Jordan. More than one person named Jordan has worked for the Smithsonian over the years, but none with the initials S. A. in the anthropology department. Here the argument is essentially: You say Sherlock Holmes never existed but Oliver Wendell Holmes did so they are obviously the same man!
  • David Starr Jordan worked with a zoologist from Washington State named Trevor Kincaid; therefore, G. E. Kinkaid must be this man. However, Kincaid (with a “c”) was not the first white child born in Idaho and not an employee of the Smithsonian. In 1908-1909 Kincaid was on a U.S. government mission to Russia and Japan and did not return to the United States until after the Gazette article was published.
  • In 1990, a series of underground catacombs were found by John Hohmann near Springerville, Arizona, more than 100 miles from the Grand Canyon, which might be the actual site of the Grand Canyon civilization from the 1909 article, as proposed by David Childress in his Lost Cities and Ancient Mysteries of the Southwest. These catacombs covered several acres and included many rooms with Mogollon burials, though later exploration determined that most of the cave system was natural rather than artificial, according to brief references in later accounts. Hohmann rappelled down to the entrance, which Little says Kinkaid did, too, though this isn’t in the article.

So, Little concludes that we are to see the Arizona Gazette article as accurate even though it is wrong about the date of the discovery, the location of the discovery, the size of the cave system, the people buried in it, the names of the people who discovered it, and sundry other details. All that is accurate, in this reading, are two surnames and the fact that it took place in Arizona. Is this enough to reclaim the article as fact?

But all of this is a fig leaf covering Little’s real purpose: exorcising his upset that I implicated his friend David Childress, whom he met in the early 2000s, as the key figure in developing the idea of a Smithsonian conspiracy. In my December 31, 2013 article, I wrote that the story of the Smithsonian conspiracy took off after Childress wrote an article about it in the early 1990s, and that I could not find evidence that such a conspiracy was widely believed before then.

Little excuses Childress from culpability by claiming that Childress was merely a copyist of fringe writer Ivan T. Sanderson, one his acknowledged sources, who accused the Smithsonian of “skullduggery” on several occasions in the 1960s and 1970s, most explicitly in one sentence in Pursuit magazine in 1972: “There has been a constant stream of accusations that the Smithsonian ‘buries’ things it doesn’t like…” However, he did not accuse the Smithsonian of being unique in this regard but, as Little himself admits, embedded this in a larger indictment of academia and indeed all museums, as Sanderson wrote in 1967: “One and all have just ‘evaporated’ like this, but, I must admit, very often within the portals of some museum which had acknowledged receipt of the relic.” Little further conflates the specific claim that the Smithsonian is suppressing anomalous artifacts with wider criticism, including some from academics, that the museum’s bureaucracy and reliance on arguments from authority in the twentieth century hindered research.

There is no evidence I can find that Sanderson’s occasional sentences asserting that the Smithsonian purposely lost giant skeletons and Yeti tracks had any effect on the wider fringe world, which did not pick up the Smithsonian conspiracy theme until Childress expanded on Sanderson—whom he cites by name—in his own work. As I noted in my article, Childress gathered together many claims of Smithsonian fraud that were floating around before 1993; obviously I am not hiding the fact that they existed!

So, I guess the bottom line is that Little would like us to exonerate Childress by freeing him from the accusation of having had an original thought. If that’s the case, I’m happy to acknowledge that Childress was simply a copyist, but I don’t think it’s that simple. He took some earlier but obscure claims from fringe writers (Frederick J. Pohl and John H. Tierney included) and wove them into a conspiracy that had heretofore been a few random hints on the fringe of the fringe. As he has done many times, Little confuses the popularization of an idea with its first proposal.
37 Comments
Clint Knapp
9/14/2014 04:07:37 am

I read the article in question when Steve felt the need to share it; so for once he proved somewhat useful. Unintentional as it may seem.

While Little's general attacks on your use of the word "claims" to describe Childress's Atlantis hunts were laughable and wholly misunderstanding of the meaning of the word "claim", I found this sentence most telling:

"He may have taken the idea from earlier accusations of “skullduggery” to a conspiracy, but these terms are expressing the same essential idea."

By Little's own admission, Childress conflates general accusations of skulduggery with ongoing conspiracy, while simultaneously disregarding the difference between the two terms. He disproves his own thesis, and still holds it as true.

It must be awful, having such a grudge against logic.

For future reference, Mr. Little, from Dictionary.com:

Conspiracy:
noun (pl) -cies
1. a secret plan or agreement to carry out an illegal or harmful act, esp with political motivation; plot
2. the act of making such plans in secret

Skulduggery:
noun, plural skulduggeries.
1. dishonorable proceedings; mean dishonesty or trickery:
"bribery, graft, and other such skulduggery."
2. an instance of dishonest or deceitful behavior; trick.

Reply
Duke of URL
9/14/2014 04:14:01 am

"Hohmann repelled down to the entrance" - rappelled, not repelled... That is, unless he was using his gravity-repelling flying suit which he got from the Martians.

Reply
Jason Colavito link
9/14/2014 04:44:01 am

I never said I could type!

Reply
Dave Lewis
9/14/2014 08:24:37 am

Your handle is very clever! I wish I had thought of that. I wonder if anybody else gets it?

Reply
Duke of URL
9/14/2014 09:42:11 am

Been using it for over 20 years (yes, I am an old fart who's been involved in computers since the first hobby machines came out) - that was always one of my favorite songs - yes, once in a while it registers with someone; thanks for the compliment.

Only Me
9/14/2014 06:40:06 am

Dear Greg Little,

I implore you in the name of decency to please refrain from future attempts to pick fights with men who are obviously above your mental weight class. Your puerile efforts at "Gotcha!" are a waste of time. Is your ego so fragile that you hound *everyone* you feel has slighted you in some way?

Your actions remind me of the old Charles Atlas ads. Like the 90lb. weakling getting sand kicked in his face, you swear you'll show Jason (or whomever) what for, and after reading a book (or whatever best suits your purpose), you reappear to deliver "comeuppance".

You simply must come to grips with the reality that not everyone thinks, interprets evidence and reaches the same conclusions as you do. If criticism is your Achilles heel, then perhaps you should reconsider your choice of occupation.

Reply
EP
9/14/2014 07:02:20 am

I disagree. Every time Little picks a fight with Jason, hilarity ensues. Mr. Little, carry on, please.

Reply
Dave Lewis
9/14/2014 08:30:17 am

When these dufusses (is the plural of dufuss dufii?) attempt to defend their position they usually end up with ad hominem, straw man and/or circular logic arguments. Has Greg Little done that yet?

Reply
EP
9/15/2014 02:35:10 am

Dave, I believe the singular is spelled 'doofus'. The plural of 'doofus' is 'doofuses', since it's not Latin in origin :)

Reply
Kal
9/14/2014 09:15:42 am

Greg has done very little. Lol.

Reply
Terry link
9/14/2014 08:20:25 pm

The post is definitely about you and is critical of your work, however if you characterize his post as "attacking" you then your own posts, (in exactly the same vein) about many fringe authors, should be categorized similarly. Goose/gander, etc.

Reply
666
9/14/2014 09:51:22 pm

The Ancient Astronaut theory is a religion, an article of faith, dressed up as a theory. At least it's not as militant claiming it is history. Like The Bible.

Reply
Joseph Craven
9/14/2014 11:07:40 pm

Do you have a quota or something?

Reply
666
9/15/2014 01:33:20 am

Aleister Crowley was the original Whitney Strieber
http://www.parareligion.ch/lam-stat.htm

Name
9/16/2014 01:41:24 am

please spare me!!! Crowley was a fraud, a hoaxer, a showman,
a publicity hound and a confidence man. Whitley Strieber believes
what he says. their sense of ethics & morality is radically different.

666
9/15/2014 01:39:02 am

Someone once asked about the link between the Knights Templar and Atlantis.

Here's one link, going back a long way
http://www.parareligion.ch/dplanet/staley/staley1.htm

Reply
666
9/15/2014 02:12:12 am

And Lovecraft's Cthulhu Mythos was appropriated by occultists entailing communication with extraterrestrials as given above

Interview with Michael Staley, editor of Starfire magazine, former right-hand man of Kenneth Grant
http://necronomicongnosis.blogspot.co.uk/2010/12/michael-staley.html



Reply
666
9/15/2014 02:27:57 am

Aleister Crowley wrote in 1944: "My observation of the Universe convinces me that there are beings of intelligence and power of a far higher quality than anything we can conceive of as human; that they are not necessarily based on the cerebral and nervous structures that we know, and that the one and only chance for mankind to advance as a whole is for individuals to make contact with such beings."

666
9/15/2014 02:54:07 am

It was in 1926 that Charles Stansfield Jones (Frater Achad) received the word of the Aeon (ALLALA = 93; becoming Plan 93 from Outer Space). H.P. Lovecraft wrote The Call of Cthullu in 1926. The occultists believed Cthullu was Crowley's Tutulu of 1909.

EP
9/15/2014 03:24:42 am

Hey, 666! Label your links NSFW please!

http://www.parareligion.ch/priapus3.jpg

Also, one person's theory is another person's article of faith and yet another person's fiction. There is no problem there.

666
9/15/2014 03:46:11 am

http://freethoughtnation.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/03/savioroftheworld.jpg

This is in the Vatican...

EP
9/15/2014 04:18:14 am

I believe that's their composite sketch of you based on your posting.

Only Me
9/15/2014 05:14:55 am

To 666:

Yes, yes, you blame religion for your horrible life, blah, blah, blah.
BIG DEAL!

Reply
Shane Sullivan
9/15/2014 06:06:29 am

And it must be horrible indeed, because I have a friend whose mother died as a direct result of her involvement with Christian Science, and he doesn't bemoan religion half as much as 666.

Reply
Only Me
9/15/2014 06:57:29 am

Allow me to express my condolences for your friend. I can only say that, for me, Christian Science fits in the same category as Pentecostal snake handling...it's downright frightening what some are willing to do in the name of "faith".

As for 666, if he had the courage to face his personal demons with the fervor he has for his anti-religion crusade, he might be considered a decent human being. His choice, his problem.

EP
9/15/2014 07:16:14 am

Just so we're clear, this is the same Dr. Gregory L. Little, right?

http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/bb/book_eight09.htm

"Just like modern UFO abductors do, demons have long been collecting sperm samples from male victims. According to the ancient reports, the succubus gathers semen from the male victims so that the demon can fully perform the sex act and sometimes impregnate its female victim when acting as an incubus."

Which makes the following typo particularly unfortunate:

"I have heard numerous urologists state over and over..."

Reply
spookyparadigm
9/15/2014 07:30:15 am

IIRC his website has Cayce all over it, so this isn't shocking.

Reply
EP
9/15/2014 07:43:54 am

What's shocking is that his job in the real world involves working on rehabilitation therapy of addicts and criminals. In which capacity he has authored and co-authored many research papers.

On the other hand, Cayce and giants do not exhaust it by any means. He's basically Childress with a university education.

EP
9/15/2014 07:46:07 am

...and yes, the two sides of the man are not to be kept apart:

http://www.amsciepub.com/doi/abs/10.2466/pms.1987.64.3c.1212

CHV
9/15/2014 09:42:07 am

Repeat after me, Dr. Little - just because something is printed, it does not make it true.

Reply
EP
9/15/2014 09:47:28 am

Little unironically needs to be reminded of that. Witness his books (thanks largely to Paul Smith's amazing bibliography):

Gregory L. Little
-The Archetype Experience: Resolving The UFO Mystery and The Riddle of Biblical Prophecy Using C. G. Jung's Concept of Synchronicity (1984)
-People Of The Web: What Indian Mounds, Ancient Rituals, and Stone Circles Tell Us About Modern UFO Abductions, Apparitions, and The Near Death Experience (intro Berthold E. Schwartz, foreword and afterword Brent Raynes, ed. Kenneth D. Robinson, 1990)
-Grand Illusions: The Spectral Reality Underlying Sexual UFO Abductions, Crashed Saucers, Afterlife Experiences, Sacred Ancient Ritual Sites, and Other Enigmas (foreword and afterword Brent Raynes, illustr John Michael McCarthy, 1994)
-Path of Souls: The Native American Death Journey – Cygnus, Orion, The Milky Way, Giant Skeletons In Mounds, & The Smithsonian (foreword & afterword Andy Collins, 2014)

Gregory L. Little, John Van Auken, Lora H. Little
-Mound Builders: Edgar Cayce's Forgotten Record of Ancient America (2001)
-Ancient South America: Recent Evidence Supporting Edgar Cayce's Story of Atlantis and Mu (2002)

Gregory L. Little, Lora H. Little
-The A.R.E.'s Search For Atlantis: The Ongoing Search For Edgar Cayce's Atlantis in The Bahamas (pref John Van Auken, intro Andrew Collins, 2003)

Gregory L. Little, Lora Little, John Van Auken
-Edgar Cayce's Atlantis: This Is The Most Comprehensive Work On Ancient Atlantis. The Authors Virtually Raise The Sunken Continent Up Before Our Very Eyes In Vivid Detail! (2006)

Lora H. Little, Gregory L. Little, John Van Auken
-Secrets of The Ancient World: Exploring The Insights of America's Most Well-Documented Psychic, Edgar Cayce (2003)

John Van Auken, Gregory Little, and Lora Little
-The Lost Hall of Records: Edgar Cayce's Forgotten Record of Human History in the Ancient Yucatan (2002)

Andrew Collins
-Alien Energy: UFOs, Ritual Landscapes and The Human Mind (1994; 2003 US Edition intro Gregory L. Little)
-LightQuest: Your Guide To Seeing and Interacting with UFOs, Mystery Lights and Plasma Intelligences (intro Gregory L. Little, with DVD; 2012)

Brent Raynes
-On The Edge of Reality: Explosive Interviews With The Leading Esoterica Thinkers of Today – Conducted, Compiled, Edited by Brent Raynes (intro Gregory L. Little, Ed. Dir. Timothy Green Beckley, 2009)

Reply
Terry link
9/15/2014 10:35:58 am

Paul Smith of Piory of Sion fame? I respect his work

EP
9/15/2014 11:24:16 am

Maybe you should ask him to sign your tin foil hat.

Only Me
9/15/2014 10:04:41 am

Perhaps Greg should remember his own observation:

"This is another example of selective perception and confirmation bias - attending to only those facts or tidbits of information that already confirm your beliefs."

Reply
EP
9/15/2014 02:36:49 pm

Greg Little's article is adorable. He really, really wants to come across as the voice of reason and moderation. Too bad he can't help but twist and distort the facts in order to fit his pre-existing agenda (which includes Atlantis, stargates, and semen-gathering demons).

For example, by the end of the article, E. L. Yochelson's claim that:

"Walcott commented that these were from his campsites and the manuscript disappeared."

morphs into:

"Charles Wolcott (the same man who essentially made a manuscript he didn’t like disappear)"

But the ending is my favorite part:

"Placing the light on Childress and attempts to ridicule him seem to be an attempt to divert attention from the actual truth. Archaeology is in ruins."

In other words, Jason Colavito is working for The Conspiracy! (And Childress is apparently archaeology's proverbial canary in the coal mine. A rotund canary.)

Reply
joseph d pomeroy
6/21/2016 01:30:43 pm

I would like to say that your argument is very logically fallible. You use induction to base your thesis off of, which is never good. Not saying i believe a lot of these nut jobs, but I think it should still be taken into account and not slandered.

Reply
Jack Andrews link
12/15/2016 04:24:58 pm

Hi Jason, remember me? (Jack) ;-) To be brief ... I have never believed the conspiracy theories about this cave and still do not. The change in my thinking from when we first discussed this until now (2016) is this: In short I think Kincaid (or Kinkaid) did exactly what he said he did in 1909 and found exactly what he described in 1909 in the cave. I also think the rooms and other areas in a cave, were modifications of a natural cave. (carved) I think that much of the speculation on the cave as written in the Gazette article in 1909 was not necessarily scientific in that it was speculation by both Kincaid and the authors of the article. (probably Charles Akers or Harry Tritle. (editors/publishers) or another possible not credited journalist/author. I have finally decided to write a book on the evidence for the reality of this cave. I will use the 1909 article as an outline and guide and mainly stick to actual evidence that points to the possibility of this being a very real place. I will not use hearsay, rumors, or conspiracy theories in my case for it being a real place. Take care and I'll let you know when the book is published.

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