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Micah Hanks Tries to Explore History Again, Wrongly Calls Iron in Egypt "Anomalous"

2/27/2018

53 Comments

 
​Yesterday Graham Hancock posted a link to a YouTube video of a lecture he gave at the Earth-Keeper Arklantis Event last fall in Little Rock, Arkansas. The lecture lasted more than two hours and presents mostly material we’ve already heard about his forthcoming book on American prehistory, the peopling of the Americas, and the possibility that a comet impacted North American populations during the Ice Age. But what interested me more was the tone of annoyance and almost anger Hancock seemed to adopt in speaking of a largely imaginary group of academics that he feels have held American history captive for decades
​Hancock’s ideas about human prehistory continue to evolve, and this makes him very angry that other people have also developed new and better ideas over time. In 1995, Hancock believed that a lost Atlantis-like civilization was in Antarctica and that the Earth’s crust slipped over its core and slid so far that Antarctica flash-froze. By 2005, he had abandoned this idea and instead claimed that a lost Atlantis-like civilization existed on the continental shelves, drowned when the Ice Age ended and floods overtook the ancient coasts. Ten years after that, Hancock changed his mind again and then claimed that a comet hit North America and the resulting catastrophic impact incinerated northern Atlantis-like cities and drowned the rest. But despite failing to admit that his wrongheaded ideas were the result of incomplete information and bad research, he is outraged that scientists have abandoned the Clovis-first hypothesis without apologizing for it.
 
Hancock says that he is glad that Clovis-first has been abandoned, but he feels that it is outrageous that only now do major journals “admit” that the hypothesis was flawed. I was taught that Clovis-first was wrong when I was in school nearly twenty years ago, back when Hancock still believed in earth-crust displacement and Atlantis in Antarctica. So I’m not sure exactly what his problem is with twenty-first century science. He seems to be railing against his childhood textbooks, which he takes for platonic constant of the One True Science. The Clovis-first hypothesis was proposed in the 1940s, and it had its heyday from the 1950s to the 1980s, when it was already under challenge. I’m not an expert in the literature here, but I know that scholarly literature arguing for pre-Clovis occupations has been around since at least 1979, and the U.S. government included such occupations in their descriptions of American archaeology in the 1980s. It’s true that it took longer than one might have liked for evidence of pre-Clovis occupations to be fully accepted, but all of that has come and gone. Hancock, trapped in the past, wants to relive old battles, secure in being on the victorious side because the war is over.
 
Speaking of outdated and incorrect literature…
 
I think it’s cute that podcaster and blogger Micah Hanks still tries to pull together articles on the model of those that I write, diving deep into the literature on some obscure or odd subject. Hanks tries really hard, but he doesn’t have the depth of experience in the literature to quite pull it off to deliver something effective. Our case study today comes from Hanks’s Mysterious Universe article from yesterday, which takes for its premise the wrongheaded conclusion that archaeologists don’t believe the Egyptians made use of iron objects, a false premise he tries to undercut with recourse to Victorian literature. While it might be simple to just dismiss his article as another fringe-type writer strip-mining the public domain with little understanding beyond a Google search, it actually represents a deeper problem in the popular understanding of history, which is the distorting effect that Google and U.S. copyright law have on our understanding of the past.
 
Hanks begins his article by alleging that archaeologists believe that the Egyptians made use of only copper instruments. “It has long been maintained that the ancient Egyptians had likely been restricted to use of copper in their metal works during the period in which the pyramids were constructed,” he wrote. He supported his claims with recourse to nineteenth century literature, where he attempts to trace the history of a curved iron blade found by Belzoni at Karnak, resembling a scimitar and said (at the time) to date from 600 BCE. He quotes a number of Victorian authorities from the 1880s and 1890s who were unsettled about when and whether the Egyptians used iron
​Such “anomalous” discoveries involving iron have long been offered as proof that smelting processes were in use far earlier than once believed. However, as I noted a few months ago here at Mysterious Universe, the most recent study which sought to tackle this mystery, appearing in an article last year titled, “Bronze Age iron: Meteoritic or not? A chemical strategy”, found that chemical analysis of iron samples from the Bronze Age were, without question, of meteoritic origin. This seems to upend the notion of “precocious smelting” that might have occurred during the Bronze Age. 
​He then suggests that modern science can help us to better understand Victorian discoveries of iron objects in Egypt, which he (wrongly) says archaeology continues to see as anomalies.
 
It’s nice that he remembers that article about meteoric iron from last year, but it’s equally clear that his understanding of the subject is limited to what is available free on the internet, and even then, only insofar as his cursory interest in specific characters and objects can take him. For example, if Hanks had probed a little deeper, he would have seen that in 1867 the Rev. Basil Henry Cooper became the first to deduce that the Egyptians had used meteoric iron to produce their iron objects. But if he expanded his search beyond public domain texts, he would have learned that in the first half of the twentieth century, scientists demonstrated for the first time that Egyptian iron objects were meteoric in origin. The claim that the Egyptians used iron is so uncontroversial that it appears in the standard translation of the Pyramid Texts, some of Egypt’s oldest writings, where iron is featured prominently as a sacred metal.
 
Had Hanks opened a standard text on Egypt from the twentieth or twenty-first centuries, he would see that the question of iron in Egypt has been an active area of research for a century. No one doubts that iron objects were used at least as far back as dynastic Egypt can be traced, and even into the predynastic, but there is great dispute about when iron came into common use for anything other than ceremonial objects. The general consensus, if one can be said to exist, is that the iron objects used in the Pyramid Age were both meteoric in origin and ceremonial in usage, and it is not until the New Kingdom that iron objects started to be used for more workmanlike purposes.
 
Here, then, is the problem: Hanks’s article is a fairly accurate summation of the state of archaeological knowledge around 1910 or 1920. But he betrays very little understanding of the literature on Egyptian iron use beyond the 1922 limit of public domain literature. For example, many of the facts I listed above were published in J. R. Harris’s 1962 revision of A. Lucas’s 1934 book Ancient Egyptian Materials, which in turn cites a half dozen or more books and articles from the first half of the twentieth century on the subject, more literature than many more modern books, which treat the question as more settled in light of additional research. But Google distorts academic and scholarly perspectives by privileging full-text Victorian public domain texts over copyrighted modern ones, where the vagaries of its previewing service mean that much of the text remains behind a paywall. So in a very real sense, the accessible scholarship on a subject, particularly an obscure one, remains mired in Victoriana because the available research materials tend to date from before 1922, those which Google has free reign to post in full.
 
It’s hard not to think that Hanks would have produced a different article if he had access to a scholarly full-text database, as most libraries offer, rather than simply relied on Google searches, as seems apparent from my own efforts to replicate his research process by entering keywords into Google Books, which returned the exact sources he cited in his article when searching out information on Egyptian iron tools and Belzoni’s scimitar-like iron find.
53 Comments
Doc Rock
2/27/2018 11:34:54 am

I don't recall Clovis being taught as religious dogma back in the mid-80s. In the early 90s Tom Dillehay gave a presentation at my university on his work at Monte Verde. This was back when the findings were still in the controversial stage. I don't recall the audience, which was mostly archaeologists from my department and staff archaeologists from the state archaeology office, jeering at him and throwing rotten tomatoes.

I guess the logic among the fringe is that because archaeologists were wrong about Clovis for a while that it means they are full of it when they reject the notion that Egyptians built pyramids in North America or that Minoans (or whoever) mined a jillion tons of copper out of the Great Lakes region 3000 years ago??

Reply
Only Me
2/27/2018 07:44:16 pm

In response to your question, there are three arguments the fringe loves to trot out:

1) Scientists were wrong about *insert subject*, therefore, they are wrong about *insert favorite fringe idea*.

2) Because science evolves with the introduction of new evidence, scientists can't provide satisfactory answers to questions.

3) Due to 1 and 2, all ideas are equally valid.

Reply
Doc Rock
2/27/2018 08:00:21 pm

It seems as though you can see similar logic in cryptozoology. Scientists were wrong in thinking that the coelacanth was extinct so that obviously means that they are wrong in their skepticism about the existence of bigfoot or giant birds and a wide sort of creatures in between. There are so many things wrong with this perspective, but it continually gets thrown out there. Well, that and the usual conspiracy theories about suppression of the evidence by shadowy government agencies.

Machala
2/27/2018 12:49:30 pm

The major joy ( and frustration ) of scientific investigation is that the more we learn, the more we realize what we don't know.

Today's prevailing theories in archeology, anthropology, and paleontology are likely to be yesterday's news, in the light of ever-surprising discoveries. No scholar worthy of the name, can rest on his/her laurels and past successes. They can't cling on to outdated and disproved data when faced with the evidence from modern scientific investigation.

Graham Hancock cannot be taken seriously, because he refuses to acknowledge that real science has outstripped his foolish notions and time ( real time ) is passing him by.

Micah Hanks, is either, too lazy, or untrained, to do more than the most cursory research.
I was, at first, inclined to give him the benefit of the doubt and believe it was the latter. However, the more I see and hear of him, the more inclined to think it is a combination of insolence, indolence, and ignorance.

Reply
Doc Rock
2/27/2018 12:56:55 pm

That is something that many fringe folks can't or won't grasp--that science is a process not necessarily a product. They seem to view it as something where an ultimate unshakable truth emerges that permanently settles an issue. Any deviation from this is model is taken as a sign of weakness rather than strength.

Reply
Bezalel
2/27/2018 10:00:37 pm

Yes
Nutshell:
Fringers mistake science for religion...because most of them are themselves religious.
Whence:
"We do not see the world as it is. We see the world as we are."
Think that's from the Talmud

Dunior
2/27/2018 01:00:28 pm

Well at least Mr. Hanks is attempting to research things using sources and somewhat of a rational view. Too bad the later sources are not available online as you say. That is a very good point and I have noted this in my searching as well. I think Hancock's idea of there being cultural sites beneath the water in coastal areas is valid but this would not reveal anything beyond native sites seen further inland at that time. I think that speaks to the fringe ignoring really interesting information in favor of pie in the sky theories that make better television and radio programming. This also leads us to the kind of alternative media mafia that exists in a kind of self perpetuating sphere. If you don't agree with the Aliens and Pyramid power plants then you don't get any interviews or tv deals and you don't get invited to "Contact in the Desert" or "Conscious life expo." We are now looking at a bonafide industry instead of groups of researchers having conferences to share data and ideas.

Reply
V
2/27/2018 11:36:04 pm

Honestly, it's VERY easy to get around the paywall issue with regards to research. You go to your local community college and take a class or two. As a student, you have access to the library resources, and there are pretty much no community colleges that don't have full access to EBSCO. Plus you get to learn something else cool, too--whatever you chose for your class.

This is how I have done quite a lot of my historical costuming research.

Reply
Pacal
2/27/2018 03:50:03 pm

I started University in 1978 and majored in Anthropology with a minor in History. In the Anthropology courses I took the attitude was that man was probably in the Americas pre-Clovis but that the evidence for such a presence was bluntly very weak. Certainly at the time that was indeed the case.

Now we have pre-Clovis sites, but what is remarkable is how few we have. I wonder if that indicates that the pre-Clovis inhabitants of the Americas were thinly, even for Hunter-Gatherers, scattered over the landscape?

Be that has it may Anthropologists and Archeologists have nothing to apologize for.

Reply
Americanegro
2/27/2018 06:51:10 pm

The graphic accompanying the Wikipedia article on Clovis https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Pre-clovis-sites-of-the-americas.svg shows 15 pre-Clovis sites from southern to northern South America on the west side to California to southwest Canada to Alaska to the eastern seaboard of North America, Texas, and Brazil on the east side of South America.

How many would you like?

How many Clovis sites do we have?

Reply
Machala
2/27/2018 07:25:49 pm

I may be wrong ( and according to some, I usually am ) but the original Clovis site was in Clovis, New Mexico. Subsequent discoveries of points and flint knapping tools similar to the ones found at the original site were called Clovis points.

The Clovis discoveries were named after the original place of discovery, - Not a "tribe", "band", or "race" of people.

I can see were calling all this areas Clovis is a bit ridiculous. There's only ONE Clovis, New Mexico.

Americanegro
2/27/2018 11:25:05 pm

In what way do you think or hope that saying all that makes a difference?

V
2/27/2018 11:41:01 pm

Machala, a number of no-longer-existing cultures are named after a site of discovery. However, in this particular case, due to the widespread nature of the points in question, I tend to think it's more of a technology named after a site, which was adopted widely and quickly. It's hardly the only time that's happened in human history.

Pacal
2/28/2018 11:49:22 am

We have c. 18 Clovis in the lower 48 states. As compared to, so-far, 15 pre Clovis in all of the Americas. See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Clovis_sites. and David J. Meltzer, First People in a New World, University of California press, Berkeley CA, 2009, pp. 239-280.

Of course it could easily be the case that a great many pre-Clovis sites have not been found yet and their apparent thin dispersal over the landscape a mere accident of the vagaries of discovery.

Americanegro
2/28/2018 12:06:48 pm

I'm sure someone's considered this but what about the possibility that Clovis flint-knapping technique was invented independently in multiple locations? Not arguing for or against just saying it seems like an obvious avenue of exploration.

V
3/1/2018 12:53:18 am

Americanegro, it's possible but not HIGHLY likely. We should see a broader range of styles than we do if it were independently invented, just like we see in writing systems, textiles, and even bow and arrows. It's far, far more likely to be the spread of a technology rather than a bunch of similar technologies. Whether that's through trade or conquest, no idea.

Americanegro
3/1/2018 11:36:30 am

The Clovis flint-knapping technique is itself a style. A style of performing a manual operation. Similarly there are [only so many] styles of making pottery, shaping a bowl by hand, building it up by the sausage method, etc. Two hands, ten fingers. This is not like saying "suppose two cultures invented the Greek alphabet independently."

V
3/4/2018 03:59:52 pm

Americanegro, pottery is quite possibly not the best choice you could have made in order to point out that it's possible to develop a technology independently, since the small differences in pottery techniques is, in fact, often how different civilizations are distinguished. Clovis, in fact, is a style that is contrasted with, say, Bare Island, Cascade, Cumberland, Eden, Folsom, etc. It's considered specific ENOUGH by archeologists to actually BE a marker of a civilization. So yeah, basically it IS similar to "two societies invented the Greek alphabet independently." Or "two societies invented Wedgewood independently." Like I said--possible; more than one society has developed a nearly-interchangeable popular motif as another society independently--but NOT very likely.

Americanegro
3/4/2018 06:24:14 pm

I anticipated you'd go that way with pottery when I mentioned it, just surprised it took so long to look up.

You are aware that "civilization" requires a city, right? The word you want is "culture".

Like Bruce Lee said "Two hands, two feet, two arms, two legs". There are a finite number of ways to make flint tools. Have you ever a) made a flint tool or b) met Captain Ramius?

Americanegro
2/28/2018 11:42:20 pm

"I started University in 1978 and majored in Anthropology with a minor in History. In the Anthropology courses I took the attitude was that man was probably in the Americas pre-Clovis but that the evidence for such a presence was bluntly very weak. Certainly at the time that was indeed the case."

That makes sense. I started college in the same era but don't remember how Clovis was mentioned.

It sounds like you were told "We've got a bunch of evidence for this (Clovis-first-as-far-as-we-know) but can't rule out finding something beyond it tomorrow." That's just as it should be. At the risk of diluting the meme,

Graham Hancock is an idiot.

Reply
Cesar
2/27/2018 03:56:06 pm

“Tube-shaped beads excavated from grave pits at the prehistoric Gerzeh cemetery, approximately 3300 BCE, represent the earliest known use of iron in Egypt. Using a combination of scanning electron microscopy and micro X-ray microcomputer tomography, we show that microstructural and chemical analysis of a Gerzeh iron bead is consistent with a cold-worked iron meteorite. Thin fragments of parallel bands of taenite within a meteoritic Widmanstätten pattern are present, with structural distortion caused by cold-working. The metal fragments retain their original chemistry of approximately 30 wt% nickel. The bulk of the bead is highly oxidized, with only approximately 2.4% of the total bead volume remaining as metal. Our results show that the first known example of the use of iron in Egypt was produced from a meteorite, its celestial origin having implications for both the perception of meteorite iron by ancient Egyptians and the development of metallurgical knowledge in the Nile Valley.”

Johnson, D. at al. Analysis of a prehistoric Egyptian iron bead with implications for the use and perception of meteorite iron in ancient Egypt. Meteoritics & Planetary Science, vol. 48, nº 6, 2013, p. 997-1006.

Reply
E.P. Grondine
2/28/2018 01:55:23 pm

I can tell you based on personal experience that most archaeologists have tremendous difficulty dealing with material evidence of recent asteroid and comet impacts, and that you can use their ability to deal with that evidence as a marker of their competency.

The same thing may be said about the data for tall native americans. As a matter of fact, it is common for many less than competent archaeologists to demean their fellow archaeologists who have excavated or studied the tall native americans' remains.

Reply
Doc Rock
2/28/2018 03:29:07 pm

Yes, we anthropologists here at the super top secret Conspiracy to Undermine Nephilim Testimonials have been working overtime to destroy the lives and careers of any archaeologists who even think about letting those 9 feet tall skeletons come to light. You have been warned!!

Reply
E.P. Grondine
3/1/2018 10:29:13 am

When I go out on the local powwow circuit, I have to interact with biblical lilteralists, ancient alien fans, and those who have read Zimmerman's book or seen his work on the internet. Usually I can point them in the correct direction with a few kind words.

But the people who really irritate me are professional archaeologists who are ignorant of the fundamental texts on the Adena, such as Dragoo's, and with the excavation reports, people who pretend to be trained, but are not, people who are more than ready and willing to share their ignorance with others.

I also interact with people who are Andaste descendants, Native Americans who are tall.

The way I handle the Nephilim believers is by pointing out to them that according to the Bible, the Nephilim were located on the other side of the world. I also point them to Andrew Collin's book "From the Ashes of Angels". Then I tell them about the Andaste (Adena) who were indeed tall.

Americanegro
3/1/2018 11:49:59 am

So nice to hear Chief tell about going "out on the local powwow circuit". You can't make this stuff up.

"I also interact with people who are Andaste descendants, Native Americans who are tall." Always less confusing when you use the Huron/French term instead of just saying Susquehannock, Chief.

Yao Ming is tall therefore there must have been a group of really tall Chinamen in the past.

E.P. Grondine
3/2/2018 10:33:55 am

Good morning, Stupid Asshole -

I always try to use any nations own name for themselves.
Susquehannock was the Powhattan name for the Andaste,
Andaste was the name they themselves used.

When I assembled "Man and Impact in the Americas' Cusick's book was not easily available. I made it easily available as an appendix, along with the other well preserved histories.

Americanegro
3/3/2018 02:59:18 pm

This compels me to revise the "times E.P. Grondine has called me a 'stupid asshole'". It's now three. I'd be interested to hear about the mental process that makes you think that makes you look good in some way. The pottymouth is getting old Buckwheat.

"E.P. GRONDINE
3/2/2018 10:33:55 am
Good morning, Stupid Asshole -

I always try to use any nations own name for themselves.
Susquehannock was the Powhattan name for the Andaste,
Andaste was the name they themselves used."

Then why do you say "Sioux"? "Andaste" is the name the Huron used. So you effed up there.

"When I assembled "Man and Impact in the Americas' Cusick's book was not easily available. I made it easily available as an appendix, along with the other well preserved histories."

Cusick's book was always available at the Library of Congress (and presumably university libraries, e.g. https://digitalcommons.unl.edu/libraryscience/24/) and available in print for purchase since 2004, so "not easily available" doesn't fly. If I have a copy it's easily available.

Americanegro
2/28/2018 04:23:05 pm

Ah, another "look at me!" post. Remember Chief that you're still on the hook to explain the Stoney Giants' Pointing Device as detailed in David Cusick's 1828 work which you claimed not to have heard of in spite of referencing it in one of your "books".

A reasonable person might argue that meteor and comet impacts are outside the bailiwick of archaeologists so expertise in such explicitly CANNOT be "used as a marker of their competency".

Sounds like someone woke up on the hissy side of the bed today.

Reply
E.P. Grondine
3/1/2018 10:09:28 am

Look, you stupid asshole, "giants" and "stonish giants" are English translations of two very different words in the western Iroquois. The "stonish giants" appear to be European visitors, while the "giants" were Andaste. You may want to treat Native American oral and written histories as trash, I don not.

Recent asteroid and comet impacts were part of the mankind's environment, and any archaeologist who is unable to deal with basic geology is very incompetent, and should not be professionally certified, or if certified, should not be hired or contracted, as they are not capable of conducting an excavation.

Let me close this by stating once again that it is likely that I have more friends of African American descent than you do, and in my opinion it would be good for you if you got your ass up from the computer and went out and met some of them.

Joe Scales
3/1/2018 10:40:03 am

"Let me close this by stating once again that it is likely that I have more friends of African American descent than you do, and in my opinion it would be good for you if you got your ass up from the computer and went out and met some of them."

If you want him to meet your friends, why not simply invite him over for a dinner party? I'm sure there's plenty of room at the table...

Machala
3/1/2018 12:55:48 pm


E.P.Grondine said: " ....I also interact with people who are Andaste descendants, Native Americans who are tall."

Regarding height, I firmly believe that diet has as much to do with size, as heritage. For example, even among our indigenous people in Latin and South America, the current generation is considerably taller than previous ones and this is directly attributed to the change in e, away from totally traditional diet. We, as a world, are growing taller on average, than our parents generation and we're not ( so far as I know ) Andaste..

Native Americans, like everyone else,come in all sizes.

Many years ago, I had a buddy,who was a Mi'kmaq from Canada. He was ( with the exception of his parents ) the smallest of his family at 6'4'' . He had a sister who was the same size and another who was 6'6'' tall. Both his older brothers were around 6'8". The family could trace their heritage back many generations and there had been no "Anglo" taint in the bloodline, yet this family were lighter skinned and much larger then many of their tribal relatives. This was a genetic anomaly that skipped generations ie. great grandfather or grandfather to grandchildren or great grandchildren.
I knew him back in the early 70's and have lost touch but often wondered, in the light of modern DNA sequencing, if they ever traced the family tree.

My own grandmother, and her sister, were Hinono'eino ( Northern Arapaho ) and both big women. My grandmother was a little over 6' and my Great Aunt was just shy of 6'.

I'm not sure how you could consider either Micmac or Arapaho to be Andaste descendants except for a linguistic link. Both the Mi'kmaq and the Hinono'eino languages are Algonquin variants.

Americanegro
3/1/2018 05:47:34 pm

"Look, you stupid asshole,"

You have me at a disadvantage here because I have been forbidden by Jason to use bad language so I cannot call you a "stupid asshole" back. But I can say your mom's box and balls on chin.

"giants" and "stonish giants" are English translations of two very different words in the western Iroquois."

That would explain why they're different in English. Don't listen to the many people who say you're not smart.

"The "stonish giants" appear to be European visitors, while the "giants" were Andaste. You may want to treat Native American oral and written histories as trash, I don not."

Take it up with David Cusick, the Native American ethnographer and folklorist whose 1828 book you said you were not familiar with in spite of referencing it in one of your "books".

Clarify if you will, Chief: when you say "Andaste" do you mean "Susquehannock"? So when you're "out on the powwow circuit" you "interact" (I assume consensually, I hope) with descendants of giants?

Yao Ming is tall therefore there were giants in China.

"Recent asteroid and comet impacts were part of the mankind's environment, and any archaeologist who is unable to deal with basic geology is very incompetent, and should not be professionally certified, or if certified, should not be hired or contracted, as they are not capable of conducting an excavation."

So now "asteroid and comet impacts" are part of "basic geology" according to Pope King Pimp Grondine? Are you an idiot? We already have scientists for that stuff.

And what are YOUR personal qualifications for decreeing archaeologists' qualifications, idiot? Arctic sea ice is also part of "the mankind's" history. Need archaeologists be expert in that as well according to Grondine Pasha?

"Let me close this by stating once again that it is likely that I have more friends of African American descent than you do, and in my opinion it would be good for you if you got your ass up from the computer and went out and met some of them."

Let me remind you again that the days when you could collect us and trade us are long gone, you racist idiot. Tell your AA friends (both kinds) "Wow I killed on the internet today, what you do, see, is make a contest out of how many black friends you have."

E.P. Grondine
3/2/2018 10:54:18 am

Hi Machala -

Yes, diet plays a big role, but in this case the descendants are 7 feet plus - usually around 7 and a half feet, and BIG.

There has recently been a study of the DNA of the early inhabitants of coastal Canada, and your friends' DNA would be interesting to see.

Speaking about diet, I do not know if you are familiar with the effects of high fructose corn syrup on the south western reservations. Its hot, they drink soda, they have diabetes, the soda causes them to be thirstier. they drink more soda, and finally they die or end up losing body parts. I think they need to consider banning pop on the reservations, and putting something else in the refrigerated vending machines.

Americanegro
3/2/2018 01:19:04 pm

"Yes, diet plays a big role, but in this case the descendants are 7 feet plus - usually around 7 and a half feet, and BIG."

That sounds like a lie. Can other people see them or just you?

"Speaking about diet, I do not know if you are familiar with the effects of high fructose corn syrup on the south western reservations. Its hot, they drink soda, they have diabetes, the soda causes them to be thirstier. they drink more soda, and finally they die or end up losing body parts."

Sounds like the sort of thing one of those diabetics who thinks their disease gives them super-human knowledge would say.

But again, it's mighty white of you Chief to give those poor benighted souls the benefit of your superior borderline omniscient knowledge.

Soft drinks don't make you thirsty. Know what makes you thirsty? Diabetes.

It has been said (by an actual medical doctor, not the Minister in Charge of Decreeing that Archaeologists Must be Experts in Asteroids) that "Diabetes is a disease of fat, not of sugar." That's adult onset 'betes BTW.

So ban soft drinks but let the giant Indians eat all the fat they want. Sounds like a plan.

E.P. Grondine
3/3/2018 12:31:12 pm

Hi Ted -

The last person to call me "Chief" was another ignorant cracker who could not believe that Native Americans had boats.

Americanegro
3/3/2018 02:34:16 pm

Dude, you probably haven't met the last person to call you "Chief" yet, but deo volente that day will come soon, like a thief in the night.

V
3/1/2018 12:55:51 am

...um.

........

....the Real World is calling. It says you're lost and wants you to come back.

Reply
Real World Control
3/2/2018 05:33:23 pm

The message was garbled. It actually said "Everything here is cool, you just stay wherever you are."

Joseph Craven
2/28/2018 07:44:07 pm

"Clovis First" was still being taught in my high school American history class in the late nineties. Of course it was also taught by a teacher who handled the subject by showing us videos from the seventies while he napped in the back. It led into his week long bigfoot unit the following week.

Reply
Doc Rock
3/1/2018 11:13:04 am

That's a problem with rarely offering anthropology courses in high school. Teachers sometimes feel obligated to try to fill in the gaps while pursuing their own hobby interests at the same time. But, a week-long unit on Bigfoot would have probably held students' interest better than most other topics.

Reply
Americanegro
3/1/2018 07:34:51 pm

Your teacher was an idiot. Too bad. Clovis has nothing to do with American History. Besides, if he wasn't an expert in meteor and comet impacts he wasn't qualified to teach American history anyway.

Reply
E.P. Grondine
3/2/2018 11:23:39 am

Look, you stupid asshole -

The kids already know about the "asteroid" that killed off the dinosaurs. Some of them get scared by this,and a good writing exercise is for them to write a letter to the President or NASA Administrator asking them what they are going to do to stop this from happening again. They get a nice response letter back, one that they'll treasure, and they learn about empowerment.

Joe Scales
3/2/2018 12:56:52 pm

Reported!

Americanegrostupidasshole
3/2/2018 01:25:50 pm

That's the second time in as many days that you've called me a "stupid asshole" old man. I look forward to your documenting even ONE case where a kid was scared by hearing about an asteroid that killed dinosaurs. That's what you consider "a good writing exercise"? And you're the guy who wants archaeologists to be required to be experts on asteroids? It's like you're TRYING to sound like an idiot.

Doc Rock
3/2/2018 08:55:38 pm

No matter what the actual sources, when I see people using the names Americanegro, Joe Scales, and E.P. locked into a catfight in the same series of posts, two images come to mind:

1.The intellectual equivalent of three monkeys trying to screw a football at the same time.

2.An 8th grade Special Olympics Debate Team.

Back to my Spring Break drinky-poos. Carry on ladies....

Reply
Stickler
3/2/2018 10:05:18 pm

It's good to know who likes to make fun of retarded people. :(

Reply
Joe Scales
3/3/2018 10:28:32 am

Hey Doc, I know you're still smarting from having a simple analogy you made and misunderstood being explained to you by the likes of me. And then of course when you doubled down refusing to see the irony of screwing it up, you drew the ire of my brother from another mother. But didn't you say quite a few times that you had moved on? That you wouldn't be interacting with the likes of us again? What was that, four or five times now? Yet you come back; again and again.

But here you go. Still hurting. And that moves me, actually. To see you in such a state of despair. And over what? Chat board posturing. My advice in this regard is for you to simply stick to your word. I mean... considering your passion for intellectual dishonesty, and now your inability to stick to your word... you're not making a stellar impression here. Perhaps out of embarrassment you'll simply slink back here with yet another moniker and start from scratch. That or you can try to be a good sport and be open to admitting error on your part. And that's what's really bothering you Doc. You need to let it go. You're not always right. Welcome to the human race.

Reply
Americanegro
3/3/2018 02:42:03 pm

Here's the internet math: when someone on the internet says they're going away they mean "Be on the lookout for my next post."

Joe Scales
3/3/2018 10:35:15 am

Oh, and one more thing Doc...

Quit drinking.

Reply
Americanegro
3/3/2018 03:10:40 pm

"DOC ROCK
3/2/2018 07:21:17 am

"Thank god for Spring Break and ten days away from the internet."

It can't come soon enough. And I'm a member of the faction that thinks doC rocK isn't all bad.

Stickler
3/3/2018 07:09:12 pm

Just so you're clear:

"DOC ROCK
3/2/2018 08:55:38 pm
...
Back to my Spring Break drinky-poos. Carry on ladies...."

Joe Scales
3/4/2018 10:13:18 am

Yes, the zany shenanigans of Doc Rock on Spring Break. Do you suppose his "carry on ladies" remark wasn't meant for us? Maybe he's watching his favorite Girls Gone Wild video and thought they were really there for him...


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        • Volume 26 Archive
    • Television Reviews >
      • Ancient Aliens Reviews
      • In Search of Aliens Reviews
      • America Unearthed
      • Pirate Treasure of the Knights Templar
      • Search for the Lost Giants
      • Forbidden History Reviews
      • Expedition Unknown Reviews
      • Legends of the Lost
      • Unexplained + Unexplored
      • Rob Riggle: Global Investigator
      • Ancient Apocalypse
    • Book Reviews
    • Galleries >
      • Bad Archaeology
      • Ancient Civilizations >
        • Ancient Egypt
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        • Ancient Near East
        • Ancient Americas
      • Supernatural History
      • Book Image Galleries
    • Videos
    • Collection: Ancient Alien Fraud >
      • Chariots of the Gods at 50
      • Secret History of Ancient Astronauts
      • Of Atlantis and Aliens
      • Aliens and Ancient Texts
      • Profiles in Ancient Astronautics >
        • Erich von Däniken
        • Robert Temple
        • Giorgio Tsoukalos
        • David Childress
      • Blunders in the Sky
      • The Case of the False Quotes
      • Alternative Authors' Quote Fraud
      • David Childress & the Aliens
      • Faking Ancient Art in Uzbekistan
      • Intimations of Persecution
      • Zecharia Sitchin's World
      • Jesus' Alien Ancestors?
      • Extraterrestrial Evolution?
    • Collection: Skeptic Magazine >
      • America Before Review
      • Native American Discovery of Europe
      • Interview: Scott Sigler
      • Golden Fleeced
      • Oh the Horror
      • Discovery of America
      • Supernatural Television
      • Review of Civilization One
      • Who Lost the Middle Ages
      • Charioteer of the Gods
    • Collection: Ancient History >
      • Prehistoric Nuclear War
      • The China Syndrome
      • Atlantis, Mu, and the Maya
      • Easter Island Exposed
      • Who Built the Sphinx?
      • Who Built the Great Pyramid?
      • Archaeological Cover Up?
    • Collection: The Lovecraft Legacy >
      • Pauwels, Bergier, and Lovecraft
      • Lovecraft in Bergier
      • Lovecraft and Scientology
    • Collection: UFOs >
      • Alien Abduction at the Outer Limits
      • Aliens and Anal Probes
      • Ultra-Terrestrials and UFOs
      • Rebels, Queers, and Aliens
    • Scholomance: The Devil's School
    • Prehistory of Chupacabra
    • The Templars, the Holy Grail, & Henry Sinclair
    • Magicians of the Gods Review
    • The Curse of the Pharaohs
    • The Antediluvian Pyramid Myth
    • Whitewashing American Prehistory
    • James Dean's Cursed Porsche
  • The Library
    • Ancient Mysteries >
      • Ancient Texts >
        • Mesopotamian Texts >
          • Eridu Genesis
          • Atrahasis Epic
          • Epic of Gilgamesh
          • Kutha Creation Legend
          • Babylonian Creation Myth
          • Descent of Ishtar
          • Resurrection of Marduk
          • Berossus
          • Comparison of Antediluvian Histories
        • Egyptian Texts >
          • The Shipwrecked Sailor
          • Dream Stela of Thutmose IV
          • The Papyrus of Ani
          • Classical Accounts of the Pyramids
          • Inventory Stela
          • Manetho
          • Eratosthenes' King List
          • The Story of Setna
          • Leon of Pella
          • Diodorus on Egyptian History
          • On Isis and Osiris
          • Famine Stela
          • Old Egyptian Chronicle
          • The Book of Sothis
          • Horapollo
          • Al-Maqrizi's King List
        • Teshub and the Dragon
        • Hermetica >
          • The Three Hermeses
          • Kore Kosmou
          • Corpus Hermeticum
          • The Asclepius
          • The Emerald Tablet
          • Hermetic Fragments
          • Prologue to the Kyranides
          • The Secret of Creation
          • Ancient Alphabets Explained
          • Prologue to Ibn Umayl's Silvery Water
          • Book of the 24 Philosophers
          • Aurora of the Philosophers
        • Hesiod's Theogony
        • Periplus of Hanno
        • Zoroastrian Fatal Winter
        • Ctesias' Indica
        • Sanchuniathon
        • Sima Qian
        • Syncellus's Enoch Fragments
        • The Book of Enoch
        • Slavonic Enoch
        • Sepher Yetzirah
        • Fragments of Artapanus
        • Tacitus' Germania
        • De Dea Syria
        • Aelian's Various Histories
        • Julius Africanus' Chronography
        • Fragments of Bruttius
        • Eusebius' Chronicle
        • Chinese Accounts of Rome
        • Ancient Chinese Automaton
        • The Orphic Argonautica
        • Fragments of Panodorus
        • Annianus on the Watchers
        • The Watchers and Antediluvian Wisdom
      • Medieval Texts >
        • Medieval Legends of Ancient Egypt >
          • Medieval Pyramid Lore
          • John Malalas on Ancient Egypt
          • Fragments of Abenephius
          • Akhbar al-zaman
          • Ibrahim ibn Wasif Shah
          • Murtada ibn al-‘Afif
          • Al-Maqrizi on the Pyramids
          • Al-Suyuti on the Pyramids
        • The Hunt for Noah's Ark
        • Byzantine World Chronicle
        • Isidore of Seville
        • Book of Liang: Fusang
        • Chronicle to 724
        • Agobard on Magonia
        • Pseudo-Diocles Fragmentum
        • Book of Thousands
        • Voyage of Saint Brendan
        • Power of Art and of Nature
        • Travels of Sir John Mandeville
        • Yazidi Revelation and Black Book
        • Al-Biruni on the Great Flood
        • Voyage of the Zeno Brothers
        • The Kensington Runestone (Hoax)
        • Islamic Discovery of America
        • Popol Vuh
        • The Aztec Creation Myth
      • Lost Civilizations >
        • Atlantis >
          • Plato's Atlantis Dialogues >
            • Timaeus
            • Critias
          • Fragments on Atlantis
          • Panchaea: The Other Atlantis
          • Eumalos on Atlantis (Hoax)
          • Gómara on Atlantis
          • Atlantis as Biblical History
          • Sardinia and Atlantis
          • Atlantis and Nimrod
          • Santorini and Atlantis
          • The Mound Builders and Atlantis
          • Donnelly's Atlantis
          • Atlantis in Morocco
          • Atlantis and Hanno's Periplus
          • Atlantis and the Sea Peoples
          • W. Scott-Elliot >
            • The Story of Atlantis
            • The Lost Lemuria
          • The Lost Atlantis
          • Atlantis in Africa
          • How I Found Atlantis (Hoax)
          • Termier on Atlantis
          • The Critias and Minoan Crete
          • Rebuttal to Termier
          • Further Responses to Termier
          • Flinders Petrie on Atlantis
          • Amazing New Light (Hoax)
        • Lost Cities >
          • Miscellaneous Lost Cities
          • The Seven Cities
          • The Lost City of Paititi
          • Manuscript 512
          • The Idolatrous City of Iximaya (Hoax)
          • The 1885 Moberly Lost City Hoax
          • The Elephants of Paredon (Hoax)
        • OOPARTs
        • Oronteus Finaeus Antarctica Map
        • Caucasians in Panama
        • Jefferson's Excavation
        • Fictitious Discoveries in America
        • Against Diffusionism
        • Tunnels Under Peru
        • The Parahyba Inscription (Hoax)
        • Mound Builders
        • Gunung Padang
        • Tales of Enchanted Islands
        • The 1907 Ancient World Map Hoax
        • The 1909 Grand Canyon Hoax
        • The Interglacial Period
        • Solving Oak Island
      • Religious Conspiracies >
        • Pantera, Father of Jesus?
        • Toledot Yeshu
        • Peter of les Vaux-de-Cernay on Cathars
        • Testimony of Jean de Châlons
        • Rosslyn Chapel and the 'Prentice's Pillar
        • The Many Wives of Jesus
        • Templar Infiltration of Labor
        • Louis Martin & the Holy Bloodline
        • The Life of St. Issa (Hoax)
        • On the Person of Jesus Christ
      • Giants in the Earth >
        • Fossil Origins of Myths >
          • Fossil Teeth and Bones of Elephants
          • Fossil Elephants
          • Fossil Bones of Teutobochus
          • Fossil Mammoths and Giants
          • Giants' Bones Dug Out of the Earth
          • Fossils and the Supernatural
          • Fossils, Myth, and Pseudo-History
          • Man During the Stone Age
          • Fossil Bones and Giants
          • Mastodon, Mammoth, and Man
          • American Elephant Myths
          • The Mammoth and the Flood
          • Fossils and Myth
          • Fossil Origin of the Cyclops
          • History of Paleontology
        • Fragments on Giants
        • Manichaean Book of Giants
        • Geoffrey on British Giants
        • Alfonso X's Hermetic History of Giants
        • Boccaccio and the Fossil 'Giant'
        • Book of Howth
        • Purchas His Pilgrimage
        • Edmond Temple's 1827 Giant Investigation
        • The Giants of Sardinia
        • Giants and the Sons of God
        • The Magnetism of Evil
        • Tertiary Giants
        • Smithsonian Giant Reports
        • Early American Giants
        • The Giant of Coahuila
        • Jewish Encyclopedia on Giants
        • Index of Giants
        • Newspaper Accounts of Giants
        • Lanier's A Book of Giants
      • Science and History >
        • Halley on Noah's Comet
        • The Newport Tower
        • Iron: The Stone from Heaven
        • Ararat and the Ark
        • Pyramid Facts and Fancies
        • Argonauts before Homer
        • The Deluge
        • Crown Prince Rudolf on the Pyramids
        • Old Mythology in New Apparel
        • Blavatsky on Dinosaurs
        • Teddy Roosevelt on Bigfoot
        • Devil Worship in France
        • Maspero's Review of Akhbar al-zaman
        • Arabic Names of Egyptian Kings
        • The Holy Grail as Lucifer's Crown Jewel
        • The Mutinous Sea
        • The Rock Wall of Rockwall
        • Fabulous Zoology
        • The Origins of Talos
        • Mexican Mythology
        • Chinese Pyramids
        • Maqrizi's Names of the Pharaohs
      • Extreme History >
        • Roman Empire Hoax
        • America Known to the Ancients
        • American Antiquities
        • American Cataclysms
        • England, the Remnant of Judah
        • Historical Chronology of the Mexicans
        • Maspero on the Predynastic Sphinx
        • Vestiges of the Mayas
        • Ragnarok: The Age of Fire and Gravel
        • Origins of the Egyptian People
        • The Secret Doctrine >
          • Volume 1: Cosmogenesis
          • Volume 2: Anthropogenesis
        • Phoenicians in America
        • The Electric Ark
        • Traces of European Influence
        • Prince Henry Sinclair
        • Pyramid Prophecies
        • Templars of Ancient Mexico
        • Chronology and the "Riddle of the Sphinx"
        • The Faith of Ancient Egypt
        • Remarkable Discoveries Within the Sphinx (Hoax)
        • Spirit of the Hour in Archaeology
        • Book of the Damned
        • Great Pyramid As Noah's Ark
        • The Shaver Mystery >
          • Lovecraft and the Deros
          • Richard Shaver's Proofs
    • Alien Encounters >
      • US Government Ancient Astronaut Files >
        • Fortean Society and Columbus
        • Inquiry into Shaver and Palmer
        • The Skyfort Document
        • Whirling Wheels
        • Denver Ancient Astronaut Lecture
        • Soviet Search for Lemuria
        • Visitors from Outer Space
        • Unidentified Flying Objects (Abstract)
        • "Flying Saucers"? They're a Myth
        • UFO Hypothesis Survival Questions
        • Air Force Academy UFO Textbook
        • The Condon Report on Ancient Astronauts
        • Atlantis Discovery Telegrams
        • Ancient Astronaut Society Telegram
        • Noah's Ark Cables
        • The Von Daniken Letter
        • CIA Psychic Probe of Ancient Mars
        • CIA Search for the Ark of the Covenant
        • Scott Wolter Lawsuit
        • UFOs in Ancient China
        • CIA Report on Noah's Ark
        • CIA Noah's Ark Memos
        • Congressional Ancient Aliens Testimony
        • Ancient Astronaut and Nibiru Email
        • Congressional Ancient Mars Hearing
        • House UFO Hearing
      • Ancient Extraterrestrials >
        • Premodern UFO Sightings
        • The Moon Hoax
        • Inhabitants of Other Planets
        • The Fall of the Sky
        • Blavatsky on Ancient Astronauts
        • The Stanzas of Dzyan (Hoax)
        • Aerolites and Religion
        • What Is Theosophy?
        • Plane of Ether
        • The Adepts from Venus
      • A Message from Mars
      • Saucer Mystery Solved?
      • Orville Wright on UFOs
      • Interdimensional Flying Saucers
      • Poltergeist UFOs
      • Flying Saucers Are Real
      • Report on UFOs
    • The Supernatural >
      • The Devils of Loudun
      • Sublime and Beautiful
      • Voltaire on Vampires
      • Demonology and Witchcraft
      • Thaumaturgia
      • Bulgarian Vampires
      • Religion and Evolution
      • Transylvanian Superstitions
      • Defining a Zombie
      • Dread of the Supernatural
      • Vampires
      • Werewolves and Vampires and Ghouls
      • Science and Fairy Stories
      • The Cursed Car
    • Classic Fiction >
      • Lucian's True History
      • Some Words with a Mummy
      • The Coming Race
      • King Solomon's Mines
      • An Inhabitant of Carcosa
      • The Xipéhuz
      • Lot No. 249
      • The Novel of the Black Seal
      • The Island of Doctor Moreau
      • Pharaoh's Curse
      • Edison's Conquest of Mars
      • The Lost Continent
      • Count Magnus
      • The Mysterious Stranger
      • The Wendigo
      • Sredni Vashtar
      • The Lost World
      • The Red One
      • H. P. Lovecraft >
        • Dagon
        • The Call of Cthulhu
        • History of the Necronomicon
        • At the Mountains of Madness
        • Lovecraft's Library in 1932
      • The Skeptical Poltergeist
      • The Corpse on the Grating
      • The Second Satellite
      • Queen of the Black Coast
      • A Martian Odyssey
    • Classic Genre Movies
    • Miscellaneous Documents >
      • The Balloon-Hoax
      • A Problem in Greek Ethics
      • The Migration of Symbols
      • The Gospel of Intensity
      • De Profundis
      • The Life and Death of Crown Prince Rudolf
      • The Bathtub Hoax
      • Crown Prince Rudolf's Letters
      • Position of Viking Women
      • Employment of Homosexuals
    • Free Classic Pseudohistory eBooks
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