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Nick Redfern Asks If the Men in Black Stalked Neil Armstrong. Probably Not.

4/19/2017

50 Comments

 
​I wasn’t going to mention Nick Redfern’s recent article on Neil Armstrong and the “Men in Black,” mostly because it is beyond my area of interest, and also because it was remarkably light on content, even for Redfern. But I saw the piece pop up a few times on social media and across the internet, so it seems like I had best point out the article’s biggest and most glaring flaw. 
​Redfern’s article concerns astronaut Neil Armstrong’s FBI file, which Redfern himself admits is rather boring. One particular incident, he says, is interesting because he reads it as an encounter with the imaginary “Men in Black,” even though a prima facie reading of the text offers little to no support for such an interpretation. Let’s look at what Redfern says and then we can see why he is probably wrong. Let’s begin with the text of the FBI file, from a February 2, 1976 memorandum:
On January 29, 1976, Detective [REDACTED], Lebanon, Ohio advised that he had been contacted by several people working at the Lebanon Town Hall, including his mother. [Deleted] stated that on the previous day, two individuals, one a male Negro, the second a white male, had appeared at the Town Hall asking numerous questions about Neil Armstrong, the former astronaut, what his address was, how many children he had, where his children went to school, and inquired if he frequently ate at the Golden Lamb Restaurant and other personal question.
 
These two individuals also went to the Town Tax Map Department and viewed diagrams of subject’s property and adjacent property and asked several questions in that department.
 
According to [REDACTED] no one really questioned these two individuals, although they were suspicious and these individuals stated they had been in town just to take some photographs of the house as they were tourists.
 
[REDACTED] advised the only description he was able to get was they were both fairly young and male, and well-dressed. The Negro appeared to have a type of necklace, which had a quarter moon with a star on it. No one observed what type of automobile or any other details about these individuals.
 
[REDACTED] advised that on the following day, [REDACTED] came to the Town Hall and was quite concerned as to these two individuals and made a statement to one of the town employees, “I didn’t think they would go this far.”
 
[REDACTED] stated he is providing the information because of the notoriety of the Armstrong family and the strange activities by these two “tourists.”
 
[REDACTED] stated he could be contacted at number [REDACTED] and that if anyone were to contact his mother regarding this situation, he wished to be contacted first as his mother has a heart condition.
​This is not exactly scintillating material. Subsequent documents in the file state that the above was collected by an Ohio police detective but was simply filed and ignored for a decade for being of little to no interest to the Bureau. It only survived to become of any interest because the FBI was asked in 1985 to put together a file on Armstrong for a potential presidential commission appointment, and as part of the vetting process they collected any information that they had. This was about it.
 
But in the eyes of Nick Redfern, this minor incident in which two people, apparently acting like tabloid reporters or private investigators, tried to do some research using public records, becomes a shocking invasion of Men in Black. Or not. Here is how he puts it:
Having read the relevant section of the file a couple of times, it wasn’t hard for me to notice the MIB-style aspects of the story. The two men were described as being “well-dressed,” which strongly suggests they were wearing suits. The reference to the mysterious pair being “in town just to take some photographs of the house as they were tourists,” strongly and eerily echoed the actions of the so-called “phantom photographers” of MIB lore and legend and which John Keel investigated in the 1960s and 1970s. Finally, the issue of the pair asking questions concerning “how many children” Armstrong had, and “where his children went to school,” very much reminded me of the actions of the MIB-linked “Phantom Social Workers” (PSW) and “Bogus Social Workers” (BSW) which I wrote about, here at Mysterious Universe, just recently.
 
Men in Black and the world’s most famous astronaut? Or, a strange and innocent affair that got completely blown out of proportion? Who knows?
​That final “who knows” is a bit of an insult to readers, since it (a) implies that any sort of random speculation is valid and (b) the author is justified in making no further effort to investigate his own utterly groundless claims. Is Nick Redfern a lazy conspiracy-monger, or is this a strange and innocent lapse in judgment? Who knows?
 
But to get to the specific problem, I’m sure you noticed that that the “Negro” young man was wearing a necklace, one with a quarter-moon and star motif. The moon and star motif strongly implies that this was an Islamic symbol, which would seem out of sorts with a Man in Black as typically defined. But more importantly, how would anyone have seen the man’s necklace if he was wearing a suit and tie like a stereotypical Man in Black? For the necklace to be visible, he either had to be wearing it over the suit, which is itself strange, or his shirt was open, making it visible, as was the style among the “well-dressed” polyester patrol of the mid-1970s. You have to squint really hard to see Men in Black here.
 
Now, why would anyone be trying to collect dirt on Neil Armstrong in 1976? That’s a great question, and one Redfern would have been wise to look into. Armstrong had retired from NASA in 1971, two years after walking on the moon, and had kept a relatively low profile. Indeed, in late 1976 Birmingham Magazine ran an article entitled “Neil Armstrong, Where Are You?”, and this was only one of dozens of 1970s articles on the man dubbed “The Hermit of Cincinnati.” Others bore titles like “Armstrong Stays Alone in His Private Orbit” and “In Search of Neil Armstrong.” Starting around 1974, such articles had become fairly regular, according to standard biographies of Armstrong. This low profile alone might be enough to explain why some young fans—or especially some journalists like the ones writing these stories—might have wanted to go on an obsessive search for him and invade his privacy.
 
However, as 1976 began, Armstrong had started out on a new venture, joining the search for Erich von Däniken’s imaginary cave filled with alien gold in Ecuador. Because it was pretty much his only major venture into the public eye, this trip garnered international headlines and dealt von Däniken his biggest PR blow ever. I’m not sure of the exact timeline to know if Armstrong’s plans would have been known in January 1976, but the long and short of it is that had Redfern extended his cursory research beyond his own assumptions and fantasies, he might have found a much more plausible explanation for the facts he is otherwise at a loss to explain. Why didn’t he? As Redfern might say, “Who knows?”
50 Comments
Tom Mellett
4/19/2017 09:45:18 am

Jason,

Did you know that there is a bona fide MIB in the infamous "Rogue's Gallery" photograph of deLonge-Levenda-Podesta, taken July 2015 in the Nations' Capitol?

You can see the photo here on Jasun Horsley's Auticulture blog. (It is the 4th photo as you scroll down the article.)

https://auticulture.wordpress.com/2017/03/01/lukes-eureka-trump-heath-ufo-swamps-cultural-infiltrations-parental-betrayals/

standing, from left to right:
Tom deLonge, Peter Levenda, John Podesta, AJ Hartley, unknown MIB

I explained to Jasun that the unidentified young man standing next to AJ Hartley, was a Millennial upgrade of the MIBs who periodically update their appearance to fit in better with the society they infiltrate. They no longer wear hats and dark suits like the old days.

In turn, Jasun also saw Tom deLonge as an MIB and then noticed a telling detail about the figures in the oil paintings behind the fellows.

He wrote this caption:

Note how the book-ended MIBs (de Longe & unidentified) have ghostly females whispering in their earsss.

Reply
Mark L
4/19/2017 07:13:50 pm

He's a pretty sucky MIB if he happily poses for photos with slightly-famous people. He looks like a relative of Delonge's, to be honest. Did anyone bother trying to find out who he was?

Reply
Just some guy, you know?
4/20/2017 04:38:11 am

"They no longer wear hats and dark suits like the old days."

That's awfully convenient, don't you think?

Reply
Only Me
4/19/2017 10:10:44 am

The MIB element in ufology is nonsense. It was nothing more than an attempt to link the government to UFOs, playing upon fear and paranoia.

Having said that, I think it's entirely possible the two young men in the report were cub reporters trying to get scoop.

Reply
Nick Redfern link
4/19/2017 10:58:37 am

Jason, it was light on content because there is not much to the story! Just a smallish extract from a small FBI file.

Yes, there could indeed be a very down to earth explanation for all this. That's why the article ends with the following words:

QUOTE: "Men in Black and the world’s most famous astronaut? Or, a strange and innocent affair that got completely blown out of proportion? Who knows?" END OF QUOTE.

Are there a couple of MIB-type parallels? Yes. Could it have been that the "innocent affair that got completely blown out of proportions" is the correct answer? Yes, of course, which is precisely why I asked that question in the article.

Reply
Johnny
4/19/2017 11:20:01 am

Wait a minute, so anyone who goes around asking about Armstrong is immediately a mystery to you? And wouldn't the people questioned about the encounter say that they indeed wore suits, just as in MIB lore?

Reply
Nick Redfern link
4/19/2017 11:28:26 am

You say, "So anyone who goes around asking about Armstrong is immediately a mystery to you?"

No, of course not. What a stupid fucking thing to say. Again (as in my earlier comments), I point out that either there is a minor mystery or it was an innocent affair that got blown out of proportion - those are my own words in the article. That hardly reflects your "immediately a mystery" words.

As for what the pair was wearing, the file says they were "well dressed." So, yes, they may have worn suits.

Johnny K
4/19/2017 12:38:25 pm

Perhaps not, but you chose to write about them, thus making it a mystery without further investigation. Hey, I'm sure you can find tons of these cases around every kind of star, may he or she have been in space or not.

And once again, please explain "well dressed" equals suits. Why didn't they just say "suits" then? Or dressed "like they came from the government" or something like that?

Reply
Nick Redfern
4/19/2017 02:31:25 pm

I didn't say well dressed equals suits. I specifically said "strongly suggests." There is a big difference between equals and suggests.

DPBROKAW
4/20/2017 04:04:32 am

Redfern - I think it's pretty low on your part to basically spread gossip on the internet to kindle interest in your new book. Gossip about a very famous and very private American who put his life on the line for the benefit of all mankind. That's low even for the pseudo-history mongers like yourself. I don't really give a shit if you care or not. And I guess because he's dead there's no reason for you to be respect of his family either. I guess there's no one to stop you. But it is nice to think there are sites like this one here where people actually do critical thinking about what others claim to be fact. Please, keep up the good work Jason. Whereas there is absolutely no evidence or proof of MIB or any other organization of that description going around and checking up on people in vital or interesting jobs such as astronauts or NASA. The only "evidence" of these organizations being you and your contemporaries imagination. That and a nentertaining movie franchise of the same name. You people write books and self publish, or get someone like David Childress to publish the drivel you write, then reference each other as "proof".
Anything for some notoriety and a buck. But that's the way it is with you people. And the fact that you even admit that it may of been nothing doesn't change the fact that your pushing an agenda to sell books. This isn't a court of law. It's the internet and anything goes nowadays. Doesn't it?

Reply
Nick Redfern
4/20/2017 09:32:32 am

DPBROKAW: As far as the book is concerned, if I was overly interested in promoting the book right now, don't you think I would have mentioned it in the article? The fact is I did not mention it in the article. And I only made mention of the book here at Jason's blog as a brief aside in response to a couple of his comments. That's hardly going out of my way to promote the book.

Nick Redfern link
4/19/2017 11:16:16 am

You also say: "That final 'who knows' is a bit of an insult to readers, since it (a) implies that any sort of random speculation is valid and (b) the author is justified in making no further effort to investigate his own utterly groundless claims. Is Nick Redfern a lazy conspiracy-monger, or is this a strange and innocent lapse in judgment? Who knows?"

Nope, it's not an insult and there is nothing wrong with speculation. As for your "no further effort to investigate" angle, that's bullshit. The story of this file appears in my next MIB book along with the Islamic angle re the necklace, which is covered extensively. That book will be published soon.

"Groundless claims?" More bullshit. I am hardly making grand claims about all this. I point out that the file "is not overflowing with mystery" I also point out just a couple of small issues that are relevant to the MIB mystery - one concerning the "phantom photographers" and the other concerning the "Phantom Social Workers."

And I fully admit there is a possibility of it being an innocent affair that, around town, got blown out of proportion. I'm hardly claiming some vast MIB conspiracy concerning Neil Armstrong - just pointing out a curious story and a couple of MIB similarities.

Reply
Jason Colavito link
4/19/2017 12:16:53 pm

So, you're saying that you published an article to spread a "mystery" knowing full well that you weren't actually presenting the whole story, but without sharing with your readers that you have more information that you simply chose not to share. That's not very nice, and it also intentionally creates a mystery where you know there is none. Readers can only judge by what the author publishes; it is hardly my fault that you have chosen to withhold facts pending another speculative tome.

Reply
Nick Redfern link
4/19/2017 12:27:24 pm

I'm not withholding facts.

The article is specifically about the FBI file - and nothing more. The book, however, digs deeper into the Islamic angle (and covers issues linking Jinn and MIB).

The book and the article are two very different things. There is nothing wrong with specifically telling the story of the file but without getting into a bigger issue concerning and speculating about Jinn!

You say that I create "a mystery where you know there is none." I certainly DO NOT know there is no mystery., There could well be. Or, there could be - as I also said clearly in the article - nothing more than an overblown, down to earth situation could have been the cause of it all.

Jason Colavito link
4/19/2017 12:32:33 pm

Do you see what you did, Nick? By asking the question and presenting no evidence for a prosaic explanation, you create the connotation that the mystery has a supernatural explanation. It's a rhetorical strategy whereby you purposely hobble one potential in order to artificially give strength to the other. I don't think you even know you're doing it. By bringing up the very idea of Men in Black (something decidedly NOT in the FBI file, but imposed on it by you), but omitting disconfirming evidence, you privilege that idea in the mind of the reader.

Joe Scales
4/20/2017 01:15:47 pm

The appeal to mystery is an informal fallacy of the argumentum ad ignorantiam type; which effectively renders it meaningless.

Nick Redfern link
4/19/2017 12:37:09 pm

I certainly did present the "whole story" of the file in the article.

The material that is in the book about the Islamic/MIB/Jinn angle amounts to strictly 100 percent speculative thoughts on the MIB and Jinn phenomena.

The article is about the file - period. That I have speculated about the Islamic angle of all this in a forthcoming book does not mean I am "withholding facts," as you incorrectly word it.

Reply
Jason Colavito link
4/19/2017 12:52:28 pm

Nick, if the article were only about the file, then you would not have speculated about the Men in Black. By introducing one (fake) mystery but not the actual factual circumstances of Neil Armstrong's life in 1976, you introduce a bias into the story in favor of your speculative ideas. You can't devote your article to speculation about the Men in Black and then claim it to be strictly factual.

Reply
Nick Redfern
4/19/2017 02:27:22 pm

Jason, the reasons why I brought up the issue of the MIB and speculated on them were (A) the issue of the two men wanting to photograph the Armstrong home (which echoes John Keel's "Phantom Photographers"); (B) the issue of the two men trying to find info on Armstrong's children (which echoes the "Phantom Social Workers" angle and Keel's "Census Takers"); and (C) the references to the pair being well dressed.

ALL of my thoughts on a potential MIB angle to this story came from those 3 ABC points above, which are part of the story the file tells.

Again, I pointed out in the article that - although I think there could be something very intriguing about this - it still might be something boringly mundane. I made that very clear at the end.

What i did with the article was to show the reader why there may be a potential MIB link to all this, but also to leave the door open to something of far less significance. There is nothing wrong with that approach at all.

Americanegro
4/20/2017 02:10:50 pm

Dude, it was the 70s. There is no Islamic angle to the necklace. Everyone was wearing hippie trinkets. Did I mention I WAS THERE?

Reply
Only Me
4/19/2017 01:10:22 pm

http://www.jasoncolavito.com/blog/zahi-hawass-walks-out-of-graham-hancock-debate-nick-redfern-defends-ant-people-article

Relevant excerpt from the post:

"Just to be clear: My problem with Redfern’s writings is hardly confined to his passage on the Ant People. I have repeatedly taken issue with areas where he seems to make superficial connections or missed out on important information through failing to pursue a story to its logical conclusion. That occurred in his flawed piece on Mikel Conrad’s Flying Saucer movie, his uncritical acceptance of UFO claims, his uncritical and low-research presentation of what an anonymous source told him about government ancient astronaut research, and his silly idea that a horror movie could help us understand underground Bigfoot."

Relevant excerpt from Nick Redfern's response:

"Whatever! I'll say and do what the fuck I like and when the fuck I like!"

Here we go again.

Reply
Americanegro
4/19/2017 02:25:58 pm

"Are you an ape fucker, Focker?"

Reply
Nick Redfern
4/19/2017 02:26:02 pm

Yep, here we go again. It's all good though, as it has been a while...

Reply
Americanegro link
4/19/2017 03:33:23 pm

Actually your part is not good.

Nick Redfern
4/19/2017 04:37:46 pm

I have to disagree, of course...

SDO
4/20/2017 10:04:24 pm

I saw a guy walking down the street wearing a dark suit. Help, the MIB are following me! Wait, maybe it could be something else.

Americanegro
4/19/2017 02:02:24 pm

Who knew my long ago trip to the heartland would cause such a fuss? Don't think I have that necklace anymore but I'll look around.

Reply
Shane Sullivan
4/19/2017 02:49:39 pm

So, what was it like working for the Men in Black? Are they aliens? Government agents? Interdimensional travellers? Demons? Are they anything like the comics? Did they make you wear a regular suit and four-in-hand tie, or a Ralph Furley leisure suit?

Reply
Frank Fontaine
4/19/2017 03:36:06 pm

At least he got it right with one being black and one being white. Although the movie never elaborated on Will Smith's character being a muslim...

Americanegro
4/19/2017 04:29:20 pm

It was the 70s man. Moon and star could mean anything. (remember Proctor & Gamble?) Anyway we were just kids.

Frank Fontaine
4/19/2017 04:53:51 pm

But in the third movie, they go back in time to the 70's, and they still are wearing black suits! And by that I mean the Tommy Lee Jones younger self in the 70's. Also, the REAL Men In Blacks are also going around in black suits and did so earlier in the previous century, so the organization must be really conservative. But oh well.

Americanegro link
4/19/2017 07:40:30 pm

You can't believe the movies man. Anyway we were just kids, not MIB. Never did see Neil.

Kathleen
4/19/2017 04:50:02 pm

I was approached by a polyester-clad government operative today. He could have been there to determine what information I may have accessed while working on federal projects at a national laboratory. He could have been delivering my mail. Who knows?

My life is fascinating using the Redfern technique

Reply
Nick Redfern
4/19/2017 04:58:11 pm

It's good to hear I enrich your life! You're very welcome!

Reply
orang
4/19/2017 05:44:35 pm

leave Redfern alone. he's not one of the fanatical, lying creeps that Jason usually writes about. besides, i read a book about him when I was a kid--"Where the RedFern Grows".

Reply
Mark
4/19/2017 06:11:21 pm

Mr. Redfern, as long as you're around: I don't know if you recall, but about a year ago I asked you about the possibility of posting the Collins Elite manifesto online. You said you'd look into whether that would be feasible. Is there any news on that?

Reply
Nick Redfern
4/20/2017 09:52:41 am

Mark: I would hope so. The problem, as I mentioned before, is that the file is not a government file that can be applied for via FOIA etc. It's the work of a private individual, so there is the copyright issue that is preventing it form surfacing. Although, I think permission will eventually be granted, but I'm not holding my breath right now.

Reply
Mark
4/20/2017 07:14:08 pm

Thank you for the update.

I stopped by your blog, and I see you have a new book coming out. Body-Snatchers in the Desert was the first of your books that I read, because I have a long-standing interest in/obsession with the Aircraft Nuclear Propulsion Program. I notice you don't mention the nuclear angle in the preview - are you dropping that part? No offense, but I rather hope so - I have major problems with the idea of a connection between NEPA/ANP and Roswell.

Nick Redfern
4/21/2017 09:27:20 am

Mark: the ANP isn't in the new book, as I don't have any new info on that angle to talk about. It mainly focuses on the balloon angle - with classified balloon-based programs far more controversial than Project Mogul etc.

Mark
4/21/2017 07:46:16 pm

But are you still asserting that the purpose of the test was a human radiation experiment by the NEPA project?

I have multiple reasons for asking. One is that I read EVERYTHING about the ANP project, good, bad, or indifferent. The other is that, if you're still asserting that, I should probably prepare a rebuttal for my blog. The claim that Roswell was a human radiation experiment is simply untenable - the experiment you describe doesn't make any sense. I almost published a rebuttal when I read Body-Snatchers, but by the time I read it the book had been published long enough ago that I decided it wasn't worth bothering with.

Nick Redfern
4/22/2017 11:29:12 am

Mark: If you go back to the book you'll see that one of the interviewees told me of an ANP incident in May 1947 (page 105), and that the ANP affair was specifically a "simulation" of some sorts (page 107) because as the source stated, "...there is no nuclear engine back then - none at all."

As for the specific Roswell crash of July 47, it had nothing to do with the ANP. The May case is the one I was told was tied to ANP and that was some sort of simulation (granted, that's a hazy term to use, and which is definitely open to interpretation).

The Roswell case (page 111 of the book and onward and to the end of that chapter) is described by the interviewee as a huge balloon array with a Horten Brothers-type glider attached. Read that section: the Roswell incident itself had nothing to do with the ANP. How could it? We're just talking about a glider and a balloon array - and that's all.

Many people who read the book didn't read it carefully (and particularly so that specific Roswell chapter 10 ("Desert Secrets"). That is the chapter which tells the story of what the source claimed was the truth of Roswell.

As he said, there's the May event that seemed to have some ANP link, but which was hardly evidence of a workable ANP aircraft, and there is the event that has become known as the Roswell incident which occurred 2 months later - and which doesn't even have a single link to the ANP and is just a glider and balloons.

In other words, I have never endorsed the idea that what came down at Roswell (specifically, in July 1947) was linked to the ANP. The only connection is that both the May and July 1947 programs used human guinea-pigs.

You say: "The claim that Roswell was a human radiation experiment is simply untenable."

I don't dispute that. I have never claimed Roswell was a human radiation experiment. The people I interviewed said there were various test-flights (for various agencies) in the summer of 1947 in New Mexico, from early 47 to the events on the Foster Ranch.

So there can be no misunderstanding, in the new book, no I am NOT endorsing the idea that Roswell was a human radiation/ANP experiment - because I didn't endorse that in my first book on Roswell back in 2005!

You are confusing an alleged May 1947 ANP incident with the Roswell (glider-balloon) event of July 1947. Go back and read that particular chapter and you will see what I mean. And, even the source of that story admitted that the whole thing with the ANP in May - as he recalled it, at least, decades later, after reading files in the 1960s - was nothing more than a strange simulation, something which unfortunately he was hazy on clarifying.

Mark
4/23/2017 11:30:23 am

It has, admittedly, been a long time since I read your book. Prior to writing my previous comment I went back and checked my review, which indicated that you claimed that Roswell was a human radiation experiment using radioactive materials rather than a nuclear reactor. If that's incorrect, I apologize. If it is correct, I stand by the claim that it's an untenable explanation, because the goals of the experiment can be achieved in a cheaper, faster, less risky way.

I will also say that the idea the NEPA was even launching a "simulator" in 1947 is untenable. We KNOW what NEPA was doing in 1947; see the following:

https://www.osti.gov/scitech/servlets/purl/129218

That document was a classified history of the NEPA project written in May 1947 to brief onboarding staff. Let's take a look at what they'd been up to:

November 1945 - May 1946: Figuring out how the project should be organized, selecting a contractor, working out other participants. (pp. 2-11)
June 1946 - November 1946: Finding personnel, negotiating the contract with Fairchild, securing office space at Oak Ridge, planning the research program. (pp. 11-20)
December 1946: Research begins. (pp. 20-32)

The letter of intent for Fairchild was only signed in May 1946, and the program of research approved in November 1946. They were still briefing the NEPA employees on "nuclear matters" in February 1947 - these guys were all aircraft engineers, not physicists. The Atomic Energy Commission didn't even exist for most of that time; it was still the Manhattan District until January 1 1947. Nuclear R&D in general was completely disorganized during that time period, due to most of the scientists leaving for civilian jobs. This included far more important projects like the atomic bomb effort. They weren't anywhere close to launching even a simulator by May 1947.

Nick Redfern
4/23/2017 12:15:05 pm

No, I have never said that Roswell was a human radiation experiment. What I said is that the Roswell event (which, in my view, did involve human guinea-pigs) was born out of the same era in which the human radiation experiments addressed by the Advisory Committee on Human Radiation Experiments occurred, which was tasked by President Clinton to investigate unethical medical experimentation from the mid-40s onward.

There is a very good reason why we can say with certainty that Roswell was not a human radiation experiment: none of the people at the site (the rancher, his family, the military personnel on the scene, etc) ever fell sick from, or died from, radiation exposure.

Therefore, Roswell was not linked with anything nuclear - just a glider-type craft attached to a large balloon array, and based on advanced balloon plans that the Japanese had in the closing stages of the war.

Yes, practically everyone I interviewed said that there was no viable nuclear aircraft in 1947. See the words of Al Barker (page 141): "...And there's the biggest problem of all: not having a working prototype of a nuclear reactor in 1947 that can be installed in an aircraft..."

See also the words of the Colonel on page 107 concerning 1947: "There is no nuclear engine back then - none at all."

BigNick
4/19/2017 07:56:25 pm

Mr Redfern- Who do you assert the MIB Are? If the do not have access to the information these two men were looking for, and do not have the means to impersonate federal agents. Is this story congruent with your previous theory of who they are?

Reply
Weatherwax
4/19/2017 11:43:19 pm

BigNick, that was my question. Why are members of a mysterious, secretive organization drawing a great deal of attention to themselves seeking information that they already have access too?

Mr Redferns' response of 'Buy my book to learn the answer to this total not mystery that totally didn't pull out of my ass' is not very convincing.

Reply
Nick Redfern
4/20/2017 09:47:41 am

Buy my book to learn the answers? Huh? As I explained in a comment above to Jason, I have no more facts to reveal, etc on the case at all. There are no answers to reveal.

All the facts we have are those in the file, which appear in the article. And those facts are slim, in terms of what they tell us

The extra material which will be in the book is (as I also stated in a comment above to Jason) 100 percent speculation and theory on my part concerning the Islamic angle, and the Jinn-MIB connection.

So there can be no misunderstanding, I have no further info on the case at all. I am not withholding any info on the file or the story as it appears in the Mysterious Universe article. The only other additional material that appears in the book is the MIB/Jinn/Islamic angle - but that is speculation and theorizing. And none of that is from the file. Or from any other file or source.

Nick Redfern
4/20/2017 09:36:18 am

I don't assert who they are. I have theories that - for the most part - push the mystery down a paranormal path. The absolute least likely scenario is that they are from a government agency. They clearly are not.

Reply
Titus pullo
4/20/2017 05:53:35 pm

By all accounts Neil Armstrong was a private and humble man. I'm sure all sorts of folks wanted to meet him. I read in his authorized biography that Gina lolabridgida popped up at the university of Cincinnati where he taught to say hi! Please let the man who was a great engineer test pilot and human being some peace!

Reply
Joe Scales
4/23/2017 11:51:16 am

Wasn't this guy a ghost hunter? What happened with that racket?

Reply
terry the censor
4/25/2017 03:23:00 pm

Nick Redfern: content provider!

Reply

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          • Aurora of the Philosophers
        • Hesiod's Theogony
        • Periplus of Hanno
        • Ctesias' Indica
        • Sanchuniathon
        • Sima Qian
        • Syncellus's Enoch Fragments
        • The Book of Enoch
        • Slavonic Enoch
        • Sepher Yetzirah
        • Tacitus' Germania
        • De Dea Syria
        • Aelian's Various Histories
        • Julius Africanus' Chronography
        • Eusebius' Chronicle
        • Chinese Accounts of Rome
        • Ancient Chinese Automaton
        • The Orphic Argonautica
        • Fragments of Panodorus
        • Annianus on the Watchers
        • The Watchers and Antediluvian Wisdom
      • Medieval Texts >
        • Medieval Legends of Ancient Egypt >
          • Medieval Pyramid Lore
          • John Malalas on Ancient Egypt
          • Fragments of Abenephius
          • Akhbar al-zaman
          • Ibrahim ibn Wasif Shah
          • Murtada ibn al-‘Afif
          • Al-Maqrizi on the Pyramids
          • Al-Suyuti on the Pyramids
        • The Hunt for Noah's Ark
        • Byzantine World Chronicle
        • Isidore of Seville
        • Book of Liang: Fusang
        • Agobard on Magonia
        • Book of Thousands
        • Voyage of Saint Brendan
        • Power of Art and of Nature
        • Travels of Sir John Mandeville
        • Yazidi Revelation and Black Book
        • Al-Biruni on the Great Flood
        • Voyage of the Zeno Brothers
        • The Kensington Runestone (Hoax)
        • Islamic Discovery of America
        • The Aztec Creation Myth
      • Lost Civilizations >
        • Atlantis >
          • Plato's Atlantis Dialogues >
            • Timaeus
            • Critias
          • Fragments on Atlantis
          • Panchaea: The Other Atlantis
          • Eumalos on Atlantis (Hoax)
          • Gómara on Atlantis
          • Atlantis as Biblical History
          • Sardinia and Atlantis
          • Atlantis and Nimrod
          • Santorini and Atlantis
          • The Mound Builders and Atlantis
          • Donnelly's Atlantis
          • Atlantis in Morocco
          • Atlantis and Hanno's Periplus
          • Atlantis and the Sea Peoples
          • W. Scott-Elliot >
            • The Story of Atlantis
            • The Lost Lemuria
          • The Lost Atlantis
          • Atlantis in Africa
          • How I Found Atlantis (Hoax)
          • Termier on Atlantis
          • The Critias and Minoan Crete
          • Rebuttal to Termier
          • Further Responses to Termier
          • Flinders Petrie on Atlantis
          • Amazing New Light (Hoax)
        • Lost Cities >
          • Miscellaneous Lost Cities
          • The Seven Cities
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          • Manuscript 512
          • The Idolatrous City of Iximaya (Hoax)
          • The 1885 Moberly Lost City Hoax
          • The Elephants of Paredon (Hoax)
        • OOPARTs
        • Oronteus Finaeus Antarctica Map
        • Caucasians in Panama
        • Jefferson's Excavation
        • Fictitious Discoveries in America
        • Against Diffusionism
        • Tunnels Under Peru
        • The Parahyba Inscription (Hoax)
        • Mound Builders
        • Gunung Padang
        • Tales of Enchanted Islands
        • The 1907 Ancient World Map Hoax
        • The 1909 Grand Canyon Hoax
        • The Interglacial Period
        • Solving Oak Island
      • Religious Conspiracies >
        • Pantera, Father of Jesus?
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        • Rosslyn Chapel and the 'Prentice's Pillar
        • The Many Wives of Jesus
        • Templar Infiltration of Labor
        • Louis Martin & the Holy Bloodline
        • The Life of St. Issa (Hoax)
        • On the Person of Jesus Christ
      • Giants in the Earth >
        • Fossil Origins of Myths >
          • Fossil Teeth and Bones of Elephants
          • Fossil Elephants
          • Fossil Bones of Teutobochus
          • Fossil Mammoths and Giants
          • Giants' Bones Dug Out of the Earth
          • Fossils and the Supernatural
          • Fossils, Myth, and Pseudo-History
          • Man During the Stone Age
          • Fossil Bones and Giants
          • Mastodon, Mammoth, and Man
          • American Elephant Myths
          • The Mammoth and the Flood
          • Fossils and Myth
          • Fossil Origin of the Cyclops
          • History of Paleontology
        • Fragments on Giants
        • Manichaean Book of Giants
        • Geoffrey on British Giants
        • Alfonso X's Hermetic History of Giants
        • Boccaccio and the Fossil 'Giant'
        • Book of Howth
        • Purchas His Pilgrimage
        • Edmond Temple's 1827 Giant Investigation
        • The Giants of Sardinia
        • Giants and the Sons of God
        • The Magnetism of Evil
        • Tertiary Giants
        • Smithsonian Giant Reports
        • Early American Giants
        • The Giant of Coahuila
        • Jewish Encyclopedia on Giants
        • Index of Giants
        • Newspaper Accounts of Giants
        • Lanier's A Book of Giants
      • Science and History >
        • Halley on Noah's Comet
        • The Newport Tower
        • Iron: The Stone from Heaven
        • Ararat and the Ark
        • Pyramid Facts and Fancies
        • Argonauts before Homer
        • The Deluge
        • Crown Prince Rudolf on the Pyramids
        • Old Mythology in New Apparel
        • Blavatsky on Dinosaurs
        • Teddy Roosevelt on Bigfoot
        • Devil Worship in France
        • Maspero's Review of Akhbar al-zaman
        • The Holy Grail as Lucifer's Crown Jewel
        • The Mutinous Sea
        • The Rock Wall of Rockwall
        • Fabulous Zoology
        • The Origins of Talos
        • Mexican Mythology
        • Chinese Pyramids
        • Maqrizi's Names of the Pharaohs
      • Extreme History >
        • Roman Empire Hoax
        • America Known to the Ancients
        • American Antiquities
        • American Cataclysms
        • England, the Remnant of Judah
        • Historical Chronology of the Mexicans
        • Maspero on the Predynastic Sphinx
        • Vestiges of the Mayas
        • Ragnarok: The Age of Fire and Gravel
        • Origins of the Egyptian People
        • The Secret Doctrine >
          • Volume 1: Cosmogenesis
          • Volume 2: Anthropogenesis
        • Phoenicians in America
        • The Electric Ark
        • Traces of European Influence
        • Prince Henry Sinclair
        • Pyramid Prophecies
        • Templars of Ancient Mexico
        • Chronology and the "Riddle of the Sphinx"
        • The Faith of Ancient Egypt
        • Remarkable Discoveries Within the Sphinx (Hoax)
        • Spirit of the Hour in Archaeology
        • Book of the Damned
        • Great Pyramid As Noah's Ark
        • The Shaver Mystery >
          • Lovecraft and the Deros
          • Richard Shaver's Proofs
    • Alien Encounters >
      • US Government Ancient Astronaut Files >
        • Fortean Society and Columbus
        • Inquiry into Shaver and Palmer
        • The Skyfort Document
        • Whirling Wheels
        • Denver Ancient Astronaut Lecture
        • Soviet Search for Lemuria
        • Visitors from Outer Space
        • Unidentified Flying Objects (Abstract)
        • "Flying Saucers"? They're a Myth
        • UFO Hypothesis Survival Questions
        • Air Force Academy UFO Textbook
        • The Condon Report on Ancient Astronauts
        • Atlantis Discovery Telegrams
        • Ancient Astronaut Society Telegram
        • Noah's Ark Cables
        • The Von Daniken Letter
        • CIA Psychic Probe of Ancient Mars
        • CIA Search for the Ark of the Covenant
        • Scott Wolter Lawsuit
        • UFOs in Ancient China
        • CIA Report on Noah's Ark
        • CIA Noah's Ark Memos
        • Congressional Ancient Aliens Testimony
        • Ancient Astronaut and Nibiru Email
        • Congressional Ancient Mars Hearing
        • House UFO Hearing
      • Ancient Extraterrestrials >
        • Premodern UFO Sightings
        • The Moon Hoax
        • Inhabitants of Other Planets
        • The Fall of the Sky
        • Blavatsky on Ancient Astronauts
        • The Stanzas of Dzyan (Hoax)
        • Aerolites and Religion
        • What Is Theosophy?
        • Plane of Ether
        • The Adepts from Venus
      • A Message from Mars
      • Saucer Mystery Solved?
      • Orville Wright on UFOs
      • Interdimensional Flying Saucers
      • Poltergeist UFOs
      • Flying Saucers Are Real
      • Report on UFOs
    • The Supernatural >
      • The Devils of Loudun
      • Sublime and Beautiful
      • Voltaire on Vampires
      • Demonology and Witchcraft
      • Thaumaturgia
      • Bulgarian Vampires
      • Religion and Evolution
      • Transylvanian Superstitions
      • Defining a Zombie
      • Dread of the Supernatural
      • Vampires
      • Werewolves and Vampires and Ghouls
      • Science and Fairy Stories
      • The Cursed Car
    • Classic Fiction >
      • Lucian's True History
      • Some Words with a Mummy
      • The Coming Race
      • King Solomon's Mines
      • An Inhabitant of Carcosa
      • The Xipéhuz
      • Lot No. 249
      • The Novel of the Black Seal
      • The Island of Doctor Moreau
      • Pharaoh's Curse
      • Edison's Conquest of Mars
      • The Lost Continent
      • Count Magnus
      • The Mysterious Stranger
      • The Wendigo
      • Sredni Vashtar
      • The Lost World
      • The Red One
      • H. P. Lovecraft >
        • Dagon
        • The Call of Cthulhu
        • History of the Necronomicon
        • At the Mountains of Madness
        • Lovecraft's Library in 1932
      • The Skeptical Poltergeist
      • The Corpse on the Grating
      • The Second Satellite
      • Queen of the Black Coast
      • A Martian Odyssey
    • Classic Genre Movies
    • Miscellaneous Documents >
      • The Balloon-Hoax
      • A Problem in Greek Ethics
      • The Migration of Symbols
      • The Gospel of Intensity
      • De Profundis
      • The Life and Death of Crown Prince Rudolf
      • The Bathtub Hoax
      • Crown Prince Rudolf's Letters
      • Position of Viking Women
      • Employment of Homosexuals
    • Free Classic Pseudohistory eBooks
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