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Q-Anon, David Wilcock, and the Rise of a New Right-Wing Populist Religion

5/16/2020

75 Comments

 
This week, Vice and The Atlantic published two important articles outlining the growing religious fervor behind Q-Anon conspiracy theories. They make interesting comparison reading. In The Atlantic, Adrienne LaFrance traces the origins of the Q-Anon conspiracy theory and explains why faith in the unreason behind its patently false claims has the makings of an incipient religion. Leading figures in the Q movement openly declare that the conspiracy has divine sanction. One of the Q movement’s biggest names, David Hayes (a.k.a. PrayingMedic on Q forums), alleges that God has personally called him to Q-Anon. the Q-Anon conspiracy imagines an apocalyptic End Times when the blood of liberals will run in the streets and Donald Trump will usher in a new Great Awakening as the angels sing choruses of Kid Rock songs and clouds of sanctifying soot rain from a million coal-burning factories.
But seriously: LaFrance notes that the structure of the Q-Anon movement derives directly from the Calvinist strain of evangelical American Christianity, whose language and beliefs are mirrored in the Q-version of a GOP-led Millennium: “The language of evangelical Christianity has come to define the Q movement. QAnon marries an appetite for the conspiratorial with positive beliefs about a radically different and better future, one that is preordained.” One Q-believer LaFrance interviewed described the current political and social landscape—which, until the lockdown began this spring had been the one of the longest stretches of relative peace and prosperity in American history—as an Armageddon heralding the End Times. Q, she said, was her savior: “Q gives us hope. And it’s a good thing, to be hopeful.”
 
LaFrance doesn’t quite question why people living in a society that is, in objective terms, wealthier, safer, and more comfortable than in the past would see its conflicts as world-ending, and thus misses the broader trends of how catastrophic economic inequality has displaced anger into racial resentment that has pushed a segment of white Americans into the arms of conspiracies that seek to restore the status quo ante, ante Obama and ante Lyndon Johnson, and maybe ante FDR and the Civil War. The past wasn’t wealthier or more comfortable, but it was often more secure for individuals in the middle class, because jobs were more often for life and pensions could help secure old age. That loss of security—in large measure due to GOP policies and right-leaning corporate bean-counters—seems to be the warrant for the whole conspiracy, whose ultimate aim is to imagine fantasy scenarios where the white middle class can once again live secure lives if only the political right could be unshackled.
 
The ahistorical irony is rich, but LaFrance prefers to see Q-Anon largely as the latest in an American apocalyptic movement going back to the first Great Awakening. That might explain the form that panic and rage manifest in, but it doesn’t explain why this moment created a death-cult and blood-faith in Donald Trump as the soul and messenger of universal power.
 
Similarly, MJ Banias’s article in Vice covers much of the same ground, exploring how Corey Goode and David Wilcock have turned their Q-Anon-influenced UFO conspiracy theories into a salvation narrative, where, for a fee, you can achieve spiritual enlightenment and “ascend” to the seventh heaven of Trump and the space aliens. As I have covered many times before, Wilcock and Goode offer a similar salvation narrative centered on another apocalyptic End Times scenario where a coming global cataclysm will leave only the Ascended to bask in divine glory. When the liberals and the Democrats and the media elite are dead in the streets and the Deep State destroyed in Trump’s cleansing fire, good people who have at least 51% positive thoughts about helping others will inherit the Earth. In the meantime, you can give Wilcock money tax-free through his “spiritual” 501c3 foundation. The pay must be good. Vice reports that he bought a $1.2 million ranch in Colorado last year, all while bitching about imitators costing him money on YouTube.
 
Wilcock and Goode are not as doctrinaire as the Q-Anon believers, and I have noted before that they mix economic liberalism with social conservatism in a way not typically seen in American politics, but which resembles some of Donald Trump’s stuttering attempts at policy, if he had a coherent ideology behind them. Nevertheless, they are adamantly opposed to liberals and Democrats, adopting Q’s most vicious beliefs, and they routinely favor conservative political candidates as potential saviors.
 
Banias says the received legal threats from Wilcock’s and Goode’s lawyer after asking them for interviews, claiming that revealing information about Wilcock and Goode would be defamatory to their “brand.” It’s almost like they don’t want anyone checking what they do with their money!
 
While Banias’s piece might have benefited from examining some of the political elements that help draw in believers, one theme recurs in both articles that is worth pointing out: an almost obsessive rejection of mainstream authority figures and especially imagined elites, particularly intellectual and media elites. “I mean, another thing I want to point out, too,” Wilcock said in a February interview on Jenny McCarthy’s podcast, “is that we are not elite or special.” He said “everybody” could dream their way to alien contact. Similarly, LaFrance quotes a Q-believer in remarkably similar terms of egalitarianism as she described how she fell into the Q rabbit-hole: “What caught my attention was ‘research.’ Do your own research. Don’t take anything for granted. I don’t care who says it, even President Trump. Do your own research, make up your own mind.” There is, of course, a disingenuousness—while making a big show of not being “elite” both movements have elite leaders who, like the French Revolutionaries and the Bolsheviks of yore, pretend to be just folks. But the undercurrent of populism and the sense of grievance against perceived elites can’t really be ignored.
75 Comments
Joe Scales
5/16/2020 09:12:37 am

"... but which resembles some of Donald Trump’s stuttering attempts at policy, if he had a coherent ideology behind them."

Yeah, that sure was some stuttering economy we had...

Reply
Play Economisty For Me
5/16/2020 02:41:43 pm

An robust economy inherited from OBAMA, who rebuilt it after the destruction and banking debacle under BUSH.

Reply
Kent
5/16/2020 04:30:21 pm

1.6 percent annual GDP growth says what? Yet he still, sine eo, saves the day!

By that logic it was ultimately inherited from Eisenhower, or as far back as you want to go. It's an infinite regress. It bears remembering that Bush (stupidly) started the quantitative easing after inheriting the repeal of Glass-Steagal from Clinton. This "inherit" stuff is a mug's game. No one forces anyone to run for President so it's more "chose" than "inherited". Did O inherit majority ownership of GM (yes, anklebiters, I know it's over) from Bush? Mkay...

Joe Scales
5/18/2020 09:55:57 am

"An robust economy inherited from OBAMA"

A ridiculous lie.

Jim
5/18/2020 05:57:26 pm

If Joe Q Scales wants to rewrite history he should take a Q from Wolter and stick to things from a more murky distant past.

An Anonymous Nerd
5/18/2020 09:21:35 am

As soon as I saw the headline of this article I knew you would be the first reply and what the content of that reply would be.

Once again I remind you that (most likely) neither Donald nor your other favorite Fringe/Right celebrities know of your existence, or care about you. No matter how often you bend over backwards to defend them while pretending you don't.

-An Anonymous Nerd

Reply
Joe Scales
5/19/2020 10:07:39 am

"Once again I remind you that (most likely) neither Donald nor your other favorite Fringe/Right celebrities know of your existence, or care about you."

An ignorant, inaccurate and irrelevant assertion. Once again, I will ask you... with a question mark this time for our more challenged readers... Do you suppose the politicians you favor know about your existence and care about you? I ask not because this would apply to me, as it certainly doesn't. I ask to clarify why you would even make such a ridiculous statement. Is it simply a personal attack of some sort?

Kent
5/19/2020 12:40:14 pm

I know for a fact that Miley Cyrus does not know about my existence or care about me. Neither does Hillary Clinton. Where I get hung up is in trying to figure out how that is at all relevant to anything.

This is where Mr. Anonymous fails. He doesn't make the case that whether or not someone knows about me or cares about me matters. The universe of people who do not know about my existence or care about me is mind-bogglingly vast and that seems to just be a fact of life. Why the point needs to be made repeatedly as if it matters is puzzling to me.

An Anonymous Nerd
5/20/2020 07:37:38 pm

[This is where Mr. Anonymous fails. He doesn't make the case that whether or not someone knows about me or cares about me matters.]

I'll do my best to convey the short version of why I belabor this point.

I've noticed that the defenders of the Fringe on these comments have a lot in common with folks who love sports or entertainment celebrities, and seem to think that those celebrities love them in return. There's something about the intensity, the word choices, the intellectual hypocrisy they are willing to engage in, etc., that evokes that for me. Doesn't matter whether it's Trump, Wolter, the Ancient Aliens hair guy, the Italian "angels are aliens" guy, or what have you -- their defenders seem to check all the same boxes for me.

Accordingly, it seems prudent remind those folks that their favorite Fringe celebrities do not return their affections.

[Do you suppose the politicians you favor know about your existence and care about you?]

Nope! But I'm not the one jumping to their defense at every perceived insult and jumping through every intellectual hurdle imaginable to defend them.

*shrugs*

-An Anonymous Nerd

Kent
5/20/2020 09:32:11 pm

"I've noticed that the defenders of the Fringe on these comments have a lot in common with folks who love sports or entertainment celebrities, and seem to think that those celebrities love them in return."

If you really think people think that that's just stoopit and you say "prudent to repeat" but I say "One Note Ned/Nancy". Case in point: your explanation/justification or whatever you call it is just you saying the same thing over again. Basta!

Joe Scales
5/21/2020 02:08:44 pm

"I'll do my best to convey the short version of why I belabor this point."

Okay, so it is just a personal attack then. Simply because I point out ridiculously partisan stances that run counter to reality on a site that one would hope to cater to those without such biases, you choose to attack me personally and imagine that although my posts are coherent, rational and sound, you would rather see me as a fawning, celebrity chasing sycophant. Pure fantasy on your part Nerd, and pure fallacy.

Way to own it.

Jim
5/16/2020 09:55:31 am

" Q-Anon conspiracy imagines an apocalyptic End Times when the blood of liberals will run in the streets and Donald Trump will usher in a new Great Awakening"

Seems to be a lot of that sort of thing going on with Trump.
Didn't the Falun Gong via the Epoch Times spend huge amounts of dollars in support of Trump in the hopes of an end of the world event so all the Chinese communists would die ?

Reply
Kent
5/16/2020 11:56:33 am

I haven't followed the "Q" movement because a) I just don't care, and b) as I understand it, it's basically just one guy. Interesting that it's named after a godlike character in STNG I suppose.

I for one enjoy a little Kid Rock. Does your conscience bother you?

"in objective terms, ... safer" Well, yeah, if you leave out Oklahoma City, the FBI murders at Ruby Ridge and Waco, the Atlantic Olympics bombing, the Boston Marathon bombing, and there's something else I'm forgetting, I'm sure it was in the last twenty years but just can't remember it.

The status quo ante, ante Johnson was in many ways better. There's a big exhibit on the National Mall that addresses just that. You may have seen it? Big old black thing.

According to Doris Kearns Goodwin Johnson once said "These Negroes, they’re getting pretty uppity these days and that’s a problem for us since they’ve got something now they never had before, the political pull to back up their uppityness. Now we’ve got to do something about this, we’ve got to give them a little something, just enough to quiet them down, not enough to make a difference. For if we don’t move at all, then their allies will line up against us and there’ll be no way of stopping them, we’ll lose the filibuster and there’ll be no way of putting a brake on all sorts of wild legislation. It’ll be Reconstruction all over again."

According to Robert Caro he once said this to his driver (presumably pre-President): "As long as you are black, and you’re gonna be black till the day you die, no one’s gonna call you by your goddamn name. So no matter what you are called, [n-word], you just let it roll off your back like water, and you’ll make it. Just pretend you’re a goddamn piece of furniture."

I won't post the quote about "locking down the [a different n-word] vote for 200 years" because some ankle biter will pipe up with "Snopes says it doesn't know so it didn't happen!" and life is too short.

"The pay must be good. Vice reports that he bought a $1.2 million ranch in Colorado last year" It's called a mortgage. You should check out the New York Times' Thomas L. Friedman's neighborhood in Chevy Chase. 1.2 mill doesn't even get you a meeting. The pay must be good.

"That loss of security—in large measure due to GOP policies and right-leaning corporate bean-counters" And there it is. Not enough of a surprise to warrant a "!"

You know who's lost security? Everyone murdered by MS-13. Afghanistan. Iraq. Libya. Syria.

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Crash55
5/16/2020 07:23:42 pm

Violent crime and deaths in war are down. Iraq and Afghanistan had very low casualty rates.

So yes we are living in the most peaceful, safest times ever. You can do searches online and find articles that lay out all the statistics. It is the 24hr news cycle that makes it seem otherwise.

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Kent
5/16/2020 09:12:43 pm

"Iraq and Afghanistan had very low casualty rates."

See? Now this is where Captain Picard does the facepalm. If there were some sort of search service you could probably find it on the Internet.

Where to start? "Tonedeaf" is weak sauce for the abortion you've dished up. You might as well say "Very few Ku Klux Klan members were victims of lynching, so the post-war South was pretty chill."

I'm talking about Little Brown Brother my friend. "You know who's lost security? Everyone murdered by MS-13. Afghanistan. Iraq. Libya. Syria."

The imperialists having low casualties doesn't rev my motor. I'm much more concerned with the victims. We lost fewer than a dozen people in Libya but it's still not ready for vacationing.

We have a volunteer military. Afghanistan, Iraq, Libya, and Syria don't have volunteer populations. It's no good when anyone gets killed or injured but this seems to be part of the U.S.'s core business. Trump has been a huge disappointment in this regard. I'm with the greatest of all time, Muhammad Ali, on this one.

Crash55
5/16/2020 09:45:54 pm

As a whole the world is still safer now than ever. That includes the wars in the Middle East. https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/excellent-beauty/201607/is-the-world-more-dangerous-now-ever

Though I must say that I have problem with the numbers of locals we have killed in either Iraq or Afghanistan. If anything we killed too few. We were far too restrained in our approach. It made it possible for the enemy to hide among the civilian population as they new we would avoid killing non-combatants as much as possible. If you expand the eligible targets to include anyone who provides materiel support, generally the amount of support drops. We found this in Vietnam when we decided that anyone carrying part of a weapon was a valid target.

Kent
5/16/2020 11:31:23 pm

We haven't yet killed ENOUGH people in Iraq and Afghanistan? Since you seem not to care about Libya and Syria I'll set those aside for the moment.

We'd certainly have fewer problems if we killed all the Native Americans.

Vietnam is your model Lieutenant Calley? More ordinance expended than in the entirety of WWII, yet we lost. That's your suggestion?

There used to be a poster that said "Travel the world! Meet interesting people! Kill them!" Not sure what your deal is but you seem to be advocating for killing more Afghans and Iraqis. For reasons unknown you don't seem to express a position on Syrians or Libyans.

Ask me about my plan for invading Belarus. Of course we'd have to kill a bunch of white people, but hey! Are you up for it?

I hope this is a work and not a shoot because what you've written is disturbing.

Crash55
5/17/2020 11:54:51 am

First let me make clear that I believe war should be the last option to resolve an issue but once that decision is made then the goal is to win the war - by any means necessary. I firmly believe that if you are going to fight a war the only way to do so is by the total war doctrine. Anything less is a waste of men and materiel.

My Vietnam reference was to a specific policy. Early in the war only people carrying weapons were valid targets. This allowed the enemy to press civilians into use to carry ammunition and weapon components. Once the rules were changed such that anyone carrying military materiel was a valid target it was much harder for them to get civilian cooperation.

There are only a few ways to win a war. You either have to win over the populace to your side (hearts and mins), break the enemy's will and ability to fight, or kill them all. The last option was used successfully by Rome but is really not a solution for today's world. The middle option is what we used in WWII. It results in lots of dead civilians. The first option is what we tried in Iraq and Afghanistan. It doesn't work well when the other side is willing to use force to make the civilians support them.

We should have used more of the WWII type approach. Yes it would have cost more lives during hostilities but the hostilities would have been much shorter. Also I really don't care about enemy deaths. They are the enemy - there sole purpose is to die.

As for Libya and Syria, our involvement there was limited so not my concern when it comes to talking about casualties. Do I think what Assad did and is doing is atrocious, of course I do. Do I think our response should have been harsher to his chemical weapons? Yes I think both Obama and Trump were cowardly in their response.

All of this though has nothing to do with my original thesis - we are living in the most peaceful time ever. Yes there are trouble spots but still as a whole the world is safer and more peaceful now than at any time in recorded history. If you want to debate that then fine, methods of conducting war have nothing to do with it

Kent
5/17/2020 03:15:25 pm

You are an interesting case. "Any means necessary"? Churchill ordered the bombing of civilian populations and wanted to use poison gas but people who weren't batshit crazy alcoholic plagiarists who needed to make up for earlier failures prevailed so the bombing went ahead but the poison gas didn't.

By your armchair logic we should nuke Iraq, nuke Afghanistan, nuke Syria, and nuke Libya just to be sure. "Any means necessary."

I understand you don't care about Libya because fewer than a dozen white people were killed but Little Brown Brother counts too and I fear you don't understand the instability the United States' action caused, not just in North Africa but in the Mideast and in Europe. You truly are uninformed.

Your understanding of the Vietnam war is woefully inadequate. Pham Xuan An, a Time Magazine employee and North Vietnamese spy later promoted to General, drove around Saigon selecting targets for the Tet Offensive but you didn't know that. Nixon, who handled the Vietnam desk under Eisenhower actually did suggest nuking Vietnam back in the mid 1950s. You didn't know that.

Let's nuke Chicago! It'll stop the senseless handgun deaths!

I'd be interested to hear about when Rome "killed them all". I think you're just making stuff up. You've crafted a character who is clearly an idiot but I feel an obligation to treat that character as if it's really you and you're really an idiot.

"Though I must say that I have problem with the numbers of locals we have killed in either Iraq or Afghanistan. If anything we killed too few."

Sorry, strong language ahead. What the fuck is wrong with you? Did we not rape enough too?

"they new we would avoid killing non-combatants as much as possible." You're joking, right? We kill people at WEDDINGS!!!

"Also I really don't care about enemy deaths. They are the enemy - there sole purpose is to die." Dude, do you play a lot of video games? Because you remind me of Jake Harper. Crimean river.

You think you can stud it up by calling out Obama and Trump for being "cowardly" on Syria? I call them out as criminals for invading a sovereign country that was minding its own business and doing nothing wrong. Assad never used chemical weapons, but even if he did, not our business. Very different from the early 80s when we sold Saddam Hussein (yeah, that guy) the precursors needed for his chemical weapons.

I won't call you fat or living in your mother's basement because that's just stupid, but the character you've crafted is woefully uninformed, ignorant of actual history, and has very little experience with the real world. That makes it difficult to talk to you, but I'm tryin' Buckwheat. Like Roger LeCoco I call everyone Buckwheat.

Reduced to essentials, you think other people should do more killing and I think everyone should do less killing.

Kent
5/17/2020 04:26:17 pm

"As for Libya and Syria, our involvement there was limited"

I didn't want to nitpick but the character you have crafted cries out for correction.

Leaving aside "We came, we saw, he died (cackle!)" in Libya, you do understand that we currently right at this very moment have uniformed combat troops illegally invading Syria and killing people there, right? Granted, by your standards not killing enough people.

You seem dreadfully uninformed and seem to think the solution to everything is to kill more people. What if I could give you a solution to every problem that only involved killing one person? Surely that would be worth something to you?

Crash55
5/17/2020 05:06:42 pm

Kent,

As usual you cherry pick specific incidents and take extreme views to try and shore up your position and instead show how little you actually know.

Any means necessary doesn’t mean use nukes, It means take the actions required to win. If that requires destroying civilian population centers then you do so. You still however operate within the accepted rules of war you have signed up for.

When we needed nukes to win we used them. Since WWII they have been proposed several times but rejected as overkill or not politically feasible.

In Vietnam the populace lost faith in the war and there was no longer a will to fight so from a political angle there was no way to win so we cut our losses and got out.

Churchill allowed his own people to be bombed to keep the breaking of the enigma code secret. We fire bombed civilians in Dresden, Tokyo’ and other places.

As for Rome, Caesar wiped out several tribes during the Gallic wars and by some estimates 2/3 of the population of Gaul. There were other incidents of whole tribes being killed outright by Rome.

You truly are a moron Kent and I will end this discussion of that before this thread further devolves, as pretty much every thread with you does

Kent
5/18/2020 02:55:30 am

"Any means necessary doesn’t mean use nukes, It means take the actions required to win. If that requires destroying civilian population centers then you do so. You still however operate within the accepted rules of war you have signed up for." You're talking out both sides of your piehole here. People of the "let's have a bunch of other guys go out and kill a bunch of other people" ilk often do that.

"When we needed nukes to win we used them. Since WWII they have been proposed several times but rejected as overkill or not politically feasible." Some people would say "when we wanted to test them in an actual use case we used them against civilian targets" but potato tomato.

"In Vietnam the populace lost faith in the war and there was no longer a will to fight so from a political angle there was no way to win so we cut our losses and got out." Stupid populace, always ruining the fun! If someone had read Giap's "People's War, People's Military Line" it might have saved a lot of trouble.

"Churchill allowed his own people to be bombed to keep the breaking of the enigma code secret. We fire bombed civilians in Dresden, Tokyo’ and other places." Damn right we owned slaves! Proud of it too! I'd do it again, but stupid law! Noted with interest: drunken plagiarizing racist warmonger wannabe poison gasser Indian starving Churchill didn't allow himself to be bombed.

I'm sorry you're frustrated but it's really your own fault for picking the "we don't kill enough people" side. Toodles!

Lieutenant Dan
5/18/2020 08:33:34 am

Anyone would get frustrated trying to wade though Kent's/American Negro's incoherent combination of stream of consciousness, Gish Gallop, and insults.

Vietnam was a mess because of the rules governing the expenditure of ordinance not the amount used which should have been used to kill a lot more people in a lot more places. That is, IF one is going with the notion of total war which is the point that American Negro missed or wants to ignore for the sake of trying to start an argument in the hopes of maybe winning one for a change.

Reading comprehension is FUNdamental.

Crash55
5/16/2020 07:30:13 pm

“The past wasn’t wealthier or more comfortable, but it was often more secure for individuals in the middle class, because jobs were more often for life and pensions could help secure old age. “

Pensions are pretty much a 20th century invention. In the late 19th you had things like Old Soldiers or Old Firefighters homes but their really wasn’t the idea of retirement that came about during the 20th century. When you got too old to work you lived with family as extended families were the norm.

Yes you were more likely to have the same job for life in times gone by but that was partly due to their being fewer job options. People though would relocate for jobs - that is what the immigrants did. There were large numbers of people in the 19th coming down from Canada to work in the mills in the Northeast.

Also remember that people didn’t live as long. When Social Security was put in place it was assumed you would die within 5 years of retirement.

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Jason Colavito link
5/16/2020 07:57:23 pm

We're speaking of the middle class. No one really imagines themselves being poor in the past. Our idea of the ideal past is still stuck in the sitcom world of the 1950s and 1960s, when today's senior citizens were kids, remembering their childhoods as ideal. That said, the postwar economic boom is historically an anomaly but one we have taken for both an ideal and a historical average.

Crash55
5/16/2020 08:26:19 pm

I know we are talking about the middle class, that is who I was talking about not the poor. The poor worked till they died until the advent of social security and some of the other social safety net programs.

You said the Q-Anon people were looking for the golden years pre-FDR or even pre-civil war. I was trying to point out that the pensions and guaranteed lifetime jobs were not the norm back then. They are definitely a product of the 20th century and then mostly the post war boom as you mentioned.

Kent
5/16/2020 09:30:23 pm

Mr. Crash makes several good points. Last time I had occasion to look at a mortality table 85 was the magic number. For people interested in this sort of thing I recommend the book "Life Contingencies", But be warned: It assumes high school level math skills.

Right on pensions too, but there were outliers: Powdermonkey Ann received a pension from the British Navy in the 19th Century until age 97. They were not pleased. Even Presidential pensions only started with Eisenhower.

"No one really imagines themselves being poor in the past." That's a bit of a broad brush. What about people who actually *were* poor in the past? Let's hear from them, shall we?

Jason Colavito link
5/16/2020 09:37:20 pm

Crash, I don't mean that they want to return to the specific policies of the antebellum years. I think ti was fairly clear that I was referring to their imaginary version of white-dominated "freedom." I hope it's obvious that there was no ideal period of perfection. The nostalgic pick and choose bits and pieces of previous time periods to create a perfect past that never was.

Crash55
5/16/2020 09:51:24 pm

Not so much the policies of the past but the status quo as you put it. That status quo was long hours of work with no expectation of retirement. The past and its status quo that they want to return to never actually existed on that we can agree.

E.P. Grondine
5/17/2020 11:25:11 am

I have been thinking that things are about to get much worse.
It has produced an almost crippling anxiety, as my work requires the use of all of the faculties I have left to me, and my ability to isolate is gone.

I do not give much thought to stupidity.

Jason,what you have not done is to show why all of their nonsense is so comforting to them.

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Kent
5/17/2020 03:44:17 pm

If you can't figure out what the obvious question to you is I don't know what to tell you.

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Jim
5/17/2020 07:26:42 pm

Let me just throw this in here for no apparent reason.

E.P. Grondine
5/18/2020 09:53:18 am

Kent, I am not particularly interested in your views.

The way I see things breaking right now is a nightmare. Reagan's tax cuts for billionaires was paid for by trade deficits, first with Japan and then with China. The reason dollars could be printed is that the Saudis accepted them for oil.

Right now, Trump is picking a trade war with Chiina. And then about July1, Netanyahu intends to annex the West Bank. And 40 years of deficit spending dollars are out there financing the international money system.

And by the way, we are entering into a solar minima.

Now what are say 40% of our fellow Americans who surroud themselves with Rush, Hannity, and Fox going to make of whatever occurs, which is not likely to be pretty?

And then there is corona going around,just the start of things. And we've already seen the "very good people' carrying assault rifles into a legislature

At some point, reality is going to intrude on this fantasy bubble. No one, and I mean with very very few excpetions, will be ready .
And our president is clinical.

Have a nice day


Kent
5/18/2020 02:24:13 pm

Mr. Grondine:

If I governed my life by what you are interested in that would be a very sad state of affairs indeed. "Puerile" is the word that comes to mind when I recall your attempt to teach me to curse in Chinese and failing at even that. "Cao nimen" were your exact words. Plural pronoun! Quite fun! What you were trying for was 肏你媽 cào nǐ mā. Ed Asner and the cool kids were not impressed.

It's so cute that you think billionaires pay taxes. Don't ever change.

"The reason dollars could be printed is that the Saudis accepted them for oil." The reason dollars can be printed is that dollars can be printed. You're too young to remember 1913 but that's when it started.

"And then about July1, Netanyahu intends to annex the West Bank." Dangerous talk, you'll be accused of being anti-Semitic. I've had my fill so you are alone on that island although you've pulled a blind squirrel and found an acorn.

"And we've already seen the "very good people' carrying assault rifles into a legislature" Time travel back to the 1960s and tell it to the Black Panthers. A legislature not composed of dullards would have already made that illegal.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mulford_Act


Actual Chinese Person
5/18/2020 05:39:04 pm

I remember that! Isn't it enough that he does his cultural tourism with Native Americans? He has to involve Chinese people too? I will translate for E.P.: "We no likee!"

The Atlantis Expert
5/17/2020 09:58:20 pm

"the Q-Anon conspiracy imagines an apocalyptic End Times when the blood of liberals will run in the streets and Donald Trump will usher in a new Great Awakening as the angels sing choruses of Kid Rock songs and clouds of sanctifying soot rain from a million coal-burning factories."

Replace "Q-Anon" with "Mainstream Republican" and you've got it spot on. ;)

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An Anonymous Nerd
5/18/2020 09:33:24 am

It's great to see the mainstream press catching on to the historical connection between the Fringe and the Right. I've posted references for this (figuratively) countless times -- if you want the references again, Mr. Colavito, please let me know. I think the references are helpful for understanding this.

What's different now, if anything is, is how mainstream it is. Lots of reasons for that, but the gist of it is a general erosion of the intellectual capacity of the United States. Stupidity was big, and everyone jumped to exploit it for money (example: History Channel), political influence (example: the Koch Brothers), and whatnot. No conspiracy required, sadly.

Accordingly it all got worse. And will continue to do so until our civilization dies.

Happy Spring!

-An Anonymous Nerd

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Joe Scales
5/19/2020 10:20:39 am

Certainly things may connect without intertwining, despite your facile musing. Once your confirmation bias finds a "connection", it also works to confirm your faulty generalizations... the illogic of which you'll never see with your partisan blinders.

Once again, politics and truth rarely intertwine, and your embrace of the former invalidates any standing you believe you may have within a rational community of debunkers. And you're also really pretentious, which doesn't make friends either.

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Elizabeth Boerschig
5/18/2020 09:42:27 am

If only you knew what you were taking about.
The reason I know this is all speculation by you is because it's pretty much what all mainstream "debunkers" say about the group.
Did you get paid to write this article?
You never once mentioned the pedophile ring (want proof of that.. research how many children go missing every year, hell every day). You didn't mention the cannibalism prevalent in Hollywood (want proof of that.. look up Celebrity Sausage or check out pictures of Marina Abramovic, who by ther way is fully funded by our "world vaccination savior", Bill Gates.)
Research Adrenachrome and how it's procured but organically.

Honestly?? Sure like everything there are people who are trying to find meaning in our jacked up world today and they feel a sense of belonging, regurgitating what others have said..but don't actually do the research and digging.
There are some serious QAnon whack jobs that believe some things that are pretty hard to comprehend ie: lizard people, alien overlords and the flat world. You will get that in any organization.
But there are those of us who have "taken the red pill". We did wake up and the corruption is not only evident, they're rubbing our faces in it.

If you want to really understand the Q Anon "movement" ask reputable people ..for Paladin. He's been researching this for over 10 years. Check out the ITNJ
itnj.org .. they have been infiltrating the pedo rings for several years. Discovering the baby farms where women are impregnated and once they go into labor, a doctor delivers the baby but there's no birth certificate. It's carried away and mom's given a big fat check.
You don't even want to know what happens to those babies. But please, dig deeper and get back to me...because this here is a lot of uneducated ramblings. You don't know half of what you're trying to peddle here.

Honestly, you almost sound like someone paid to discredit those who follow QAnon.
Were you paid to write this?
If so, I hope you know who you're working for.
#WWG1WGA

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Jim
5/18/2020 11:55:15 am

Has anyone seen my shovel ?

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Mandalore
5/19/2020 09:24:35 pm

Holy shit, that's some crazy. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Gonna need some cannibalism evidence. You need to prove your outlandish claims, not tell others to find the sources to prove what you are claiming.

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Terry Melanson link
5/18/2020 11:21:05 am

It was inevitable that Q would attract fundamentalists and those obsessed with the end times. If there is a redeeming quality in the movement, it is that at least they do try and research things. Data accumulation, mostly, but lots of it. There are some twitter threads from Q supporters that really do uncover things and is a worthwhile endeavor and has been adding to a real knowledge base about the elite. Some of them will no doubt ditch the Q nuttiness and segue into less bias and more skepticism.

I've been around, and involved with, conspiracy thinking since the 90s. The obsessive "research" aspect of this movement is something new and is a way out for those who engage in it, at least if they make source criticism a priority in future investigations and check and then re-check first assumptions.

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Kent
5/18/2020 01:59:43 pm

"I've been around, and involved with, conspiracy thinking since the 90s. The obsessive "research" aspect of this movement is something new"

HUH??? JFK assassination? RFK assassination? Danny Casolaro murder??? Iran Contra? Have you read Mills' Underground Empire? What is this "something new" poop? Hey I hear there's this new style of music coming out of the ghettos barrios and cottonfields. It's called bebop, descends from something called "the blues". I tell ya, they're both going to be big!

If it's not on my nightstand, you don't need it. When I have something valuable I hide it in pumpkin.

Why don't you research why Bush 41 was the only adult of his time who didn't know where he was when JFK was assassinated?

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An ANonymous Nerd
5/18/2020 04:12:41 pm

[ they do try and research things]

[ The obsessive "research" aspect of this movement is something new and is a way out for those who engage in it]

Do you have examples? Because what I've seen it isn't really research exactly it's casting about until they find one thing that they want to see, then blow it out of proportion. And that ain't new. UFO type conspiracy folks, Nibiru type conspiracy folks, White Supremacist type conspiracy folks, and Ancient Alien type conspiracy folks have done the same thing for decades.

And that ain't research in any meaningful sense, it's random casting about. It's no more research than Scott Wolter did "research" by talking to what's her name who kept a second-hand copy of supposedly-Templar journals.

-An Anonymous Nerd

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Terry Melanson link
5/18/2020 05:14:15 pm

I'm thinking of people on twitter like Dr Quigley and a few others. At one point they were posting massive threads on various topics, everyday. It spurred me to check their initial research and the data mostly checked out, though the conclusions of the size and scope of things were a bit naive. At a certain level everything is connected, and they were/are looking at the elite and its behemoth apparatus.

I'm aware of leftist conspiracy theorists, also marxist conspiracy theorists, and their penchant for erudition and scholarly offerings. It's a different world now and twitter and the web as a whole is a different beast. JFK research cooperatives still exist but others, just as obsessed, do as well.

An Anonymous Nerd
5/18/2020 10:11:57 pm

[I'm thinking of people on twitter like Dr Quigley and a few others.]

Dr Quigley as in @CarrolQuigley1 on Twitter, which seemingly isn't the same as the Historian I hadn't heard of before this search.

I see no evidence of research there other than him using the word "research" periodically. He re-posted the Trump pretending to be the fictional president from "Independence Day," a dude who claimed he figured out how COVID19 was engineered, a lady who's protesting against contact tracing, a bunch of stuff from Fox News, and a bunch of random stuff along those lines.

"massive threads" are pretty easy to do.

So, no.

Left-leaning Conspiracy Fantasies surely do exist and have existed in the past, wherein they were more numerous. However, the issue, as I have explained repeatedly, is that they were and are recognized as fantasies whereas on the Right they are mainstream.

-An Anonymous Nerd

Terry Melanson
5/19/2020 08:38:38 am

Hadn't heard of the real, late, Dr. Quigley before this? Ya, he was a historian and quite important to right leaning Birchers as they used his research to prop up their own conspiracies.

As for Dr. Quigley on twitter: During the Epstein affair, the threads he would put together - the minutia just for the sake of data accumulation - made it's way into pieces by Whitney Webb weeks later, and then msm outlets at least a month or more later. Reporters were following him during this time (or had him on a list so it wouldn't show that they were "following" him). Monitoring them both at the same time made it exceedingly obvious that they ran with the leads first developed by him and a few others.

Kent
5/19/2020 10:48:38 am

"I'm thinking of people on twitter"

I think I see the problem.

Joe Scales
5/20/2020 10:15:35 am

"Left-leaning Conspiracy Fantasies surely do exist and have existed in the past, wherein they were more numerous. However, the issue, as I have explained repeatedly, is that they were and are recognized as fantasies whereas on the Right they are mainstream."

You must have been asleep for the past three years. Russian collusion anyone?

Kent
5/20/2020 01:05:50 pm

Leave us not forget the Russian gummint flooding the infosphere with fake UFO stories to bamboozle the American public.

An Anonymous Nerd
5/20/2020 09:39:25 pm

[You must have been asleep for the past three years. Russian collusion anyone? ]

[quote]

There you go again, Mr. Scales. Unfortunately, it takes but a few lines to spread bunk, but far longer to debunk it.

I have long-described the historical connection between the Fringe and the Right, and more-importantly for present purposes the degree to which Fringe concepts are mainstream on the Right, and articulated many examples of this -- has has Mr. Colavito. Against this you have asserted that the notion that President Trump's campaign may have colluded with Russia somehow disproves all of it or, at minimum, puts the Left on an equal footing with the Right.

In doing this, you're engaging in a classic Fringe tactic of the "false dichotomy" or the "false dilemma." "Ancient Aliens" does it a lot, as does Scott Wolter, so you're in great company.

And this is why. I'll begin with some examples of the special relationship between the Fringe and the Right, which I've collected and have cited these before and it's not my fault that you choose to ignore them.

The rightist politics of the ancient aliens folks. The denial of Evolution. The denial of Global Warming. The perpetuation of conspiracy fantasies about Bill Clinton and Hilary Clinton (Vince Foster didn't kill himself, the existence of a "Clinton list" of people he's supposed to have murdered, etc.). The Alex Jones empire and the fringe foundation it's built on. The relationship between President Trump and Jones. The current President's obsession with taking things back and making stuff 'great' again (referencing certain concepts in fringe history, as Jason has demonstrated a few times here). The current President's wondering why the Civil War had to happen and why no one is asking that question (lots of stuff written about the causes of the Civil War actually). The current President's equation of the Founding Fathers and the leaders of the Confederacy (I refer to the statue controversy). Glenn Beck's embrace of the theory that the American Indians were descended from the Lost Tribes of Israel and wrote in Hebrew. Glenn Beck's embrace of various conspiracy theories involving the founder of the Federal Reserve, Bill O'Reilly's attempt to whitewash (ho ho!, see what I did there) the horrors of slavery . The Conservative mainstreaming of the QAnon and "White Replacement" conspiracy fantasies (the subject of this very article). The President's "very fine people" remark about White Nationalists in the wake of a murder. The Conservative mainstreaming of the "Epoch Times" and, presumably, the underlying ideology of it. Tucker Carlson's attempt to call White Nationalism a hoax even in the wake of the El Paso incident. Your own embrace of a wild conspiracy fantasy which I have pointed out elsewhere.

Let us also touch, all-too-briefly, on the attempts of the Right to call the current virus, and its effects, a hoax. Let us also touch on the current Conservative President's coming to prominence in political circles by asserting that President Obama wasn't born in the United States.

For a fuller explication of the historical connections between the fringe and the Right, I refer you to Richard Hofstadter's "The Paranoid Style in American Politics" and "Anti-Intellectualism in American Life." I forget just how focused both works were on the Right (been a long time since I read them), they may have bent over backwards to be fair (which is not necessarily a bad thing, to be sure).

The Left Fringe exists to be sure. However Lefty fringe things are called out for being what they are, whereas Righty fringe things are well-funded and considered mainstream. (Example one: Hillary Clinton's "vast right wing conspiracy" comment is held up for ridicule to this very day, whereas the History Channel and Alex Jones make millions off of way, way worse things. Example two: Hillary Clinton's consultation with a psychic, and I'm being generous to the right in characterizing it this way [this is the Eleanor Roosevelt thing], was ridiculed way, way more than the Reagans's consultation with Astrologers.)

Ok so that's what I've got -- and that's just an abbreviated, partial list.....Against this you assert that the possibility being raised of collusion between the Trump campaign and Russia creates equivalency. To do this successfully, in terms of the merits of the argument, you would have to do two things at minimum. One is you would have to somehow show that this one thing somehow is equivalent to the long list I have provided, and that list is only partial.

Obviously you fail there. But we'll move along to the second thing anyway: You would have to show that the possibility of the Trump campaign colluding with Russia was somehow a Fringe concept. This of course goes beyond asserting that collusion didn't happen -- you'd have to show enough that it could be considered a "Fringe" concept.

And the answer is no, it wasn't. Google the phrase Trump Tower Meeting and

An Anonymous Nerd
5/21/2020 07:31:47 am

My post appears to have cut off. Here is the rest.

....and see the list of sources on the Wikipedia entry.

The mere fact of that meeting, even though it itself amounted to little, is enough to show that wondering if collusion happened is not a Fringe concept. Also note that that meeting proved to be just a minor entry in a larger report done by a long-time political operative that showed the Russian support for then-candidate Trump. With all that the idea that collusion occurred is not a Fringe concept, it's a reasonable extrapolation from evidence that proved incorrect but barely so. That meeting suggests quite mightily that the campaign was totally ok with colluding, it just ended up not happening. *shrugs*

So all told, no, your argument fails on the merits.

I know I will not convert you Mr. Scales -- I post as a service to those who might make the error of taking your false equivalence seriously.

-An Anonymous Nerd

Jim
5/21/2020 10:47:05 am

Mr Nerd, I am not sure I totally agree with this part:

" it's a reasonable extrapolation from evidence that proved incorrect but barely so. That meeting suggests quite mightily that the campaign was totally ok with colluding, it just ended up not happening."

It was not "proved incorrect" but rather was not PROVEN to be correct.

From the lack of transparency, documents and witnesses (willing or otherwise) that were prevented from testifying, I submit that the jury is still out.
We also have the bizarre truth that key elements of the main investigation into this (Mueller Report) still remains a secret and even your top lawmakers are left without full disclosure of the Investigation.
Pretty tough to come to a conclusion when key witnesses, underlying documents and likely damming evidence from the investigation itself are kept from those who would be the jury.

As someone likes to say "It was rigged!".

Joe Scales
5/21/2020 02:16:53 pm

"There you go again, Mr. Scales. Unfortunately, it takes but a few lines to spread bunk, but far longer to debunk it."

That's a lot of nonsense there Nerd. I mean really... a whole bunch of nonsense. Thing is, I already "debunked" your "special connection" above with two lines. I'll repeat them for you here:

"Certainly things may connect without intertwining, despite your facile musing. Once your confirmation bias finds a "connection", it also works to confirm your faulty generalizations... the illogic of which you'll never see with your partisan blinders."

And Russian Collusion remains a conspiracy theory. Funny how you won't let that go. But that's what conspiracy theory folks do... they hold on despite the truth... and you've become what you hate Nerd. And after all this time, you still don't know what the hell a false dilemma is. Get an education please. Informal fallacies can be dangerous.

Kent
5/21/2020 04:33:37 pm

It's known that the Trump campaign wanted backchannel communications with the Russian gummint.

It's known that the Russian gummint said "No way!"

It's known that colluding with someone who doesn't want to collude with you is really difficult to say the least.

An Anonymous Nerd
5/21/2020 04:34:12 pm

[insert the latest random Joe Scales post here]

There you go again, Mr. Scales. You have attempted to counter detailed posts of mine with a few one-liners. On the merits you've failed (to demonstrate this again would be merely to re-post the stuff I've already posted), but most-likely in the court of public opinion you and and others of this ilk, such as President Trump and Scott Wolter, will continue to find success. Enjoy the company.

*shrugs*

-An Anonymous Nerd

Jim
5/21/2020 05:42:00 pm

Joe Q Scales: "And Russian Collusion remains a conspiracy theory."

Kentypoo: "It's known that colluding with someone who doesn't want to collude with you is really difficult to say the least."

https://www.politifact.com/article/2017/dec/01/flynns-guilty-plea-confirms-he-talked-russian-sanc/

"The charging document reveals that on or about Dec. 29, Flynn asked Kislyak to "refrain from escalating the situation in response to sanctions that the United States had imposed on Russia that same day." The document also reveals that Kislyak told Flynn that Russia "had chosen to moderate its response to those sanctions as a result of his request."

That's collusion with a capitol K, Komrade !

col·lu·sion

noun: collusion
secret or illegal cooperation or conspiracy, especially in order to cheat or deceive others.

An Anonymous Nerd
5/21/2020 07:08:31 pm

[As for Dr. Quigley on twitter: During the Epstein affair, the threads he would put together - the minutia just for the sake of data accumulation - made it's way into pieces by Whitney Webb weeks later, and then msm outlets at least a month or more later. Reporters were following him during this time (or had him on a list so it wouldn't show that they were "following" him).]

Umm.....Ok once again you'll have to provide examples because these claims seem difficult to verify.

Citing anything related to Epstein is a bit of a red flag at this point given how many conspiracy fantasies seek to tie Mrs. Clinton to his suicide. (Seriously, folks: How was she in a position to infiltrate a prison operated by the government headed by the dude who defeated her in the election?) And, sadly, using the acronym MSM is another red flag. (The days when the term "mainstream media" was used by media scholars to differentiate alternative media from media designed for, and consumed by, a mass audience are long gone. The term's pretty much taken over by conspiracy fantasies. As far as I can tell, anyway.)

Using his Twitter ID and "Jeffrey Epstein" as a Google search term got no meaningful results.

Can you tell me about a specific article that you feel was influenced by him in some way? Him being cited would be best, because claiming "I said this first" is very easy to do.

-An Anonymous Nerd

Kent
5/21/2020 11:55:51 pm

"Kentypoo: "It's known that colluding with someone who doesn't want to collude with you is really difficult to say the least.""

Your childish playing of a name-game brings shame upon your country and the Commonwealth. But I will respond in kind:

Jimmynipplekins: There is no doubt that Flynn lied. So effing what? I'm dating an FBI agent. Am I not allowed to lie to him? Some would say it was stupid to hire Flynn when really accomplished liars like Clapper and Brennan were available.

I know Canadians love their Snopes, so:

As he was leaning toward Medvedev in Seoul, Obama was overheard asking for time — “particularly with missile defense” — until he is in a better position politically to resolve such issues.

“I understand your message about space,” replied Medvedev, who will hand over the presidency to Putin in May.

“This is my last election … After my election I have more flexibility,” Obama said, expressing confidence that he would win a second term.

“I will transmit this information to Vladimir,” said Medvedev, Putin’s protégé and long considered number two in Moscow’s power structure.

The exchange, parts of it inaudible, was monitored by a White House pool of television journalists as well as Russian reporters listening live from their press center.

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/obama-more-flexibility-russia/

Jim
5/22/2020 10:11:29 am

A strawman argument ???,,really ?
In other words,,,you got nothing.

Kent
5/22/2020 10:33:42 am

This is the first I'm hearing of Mrs. Clinton being tied to Epstein's murder so I wonder how widespread this theory actually is. But you are right to point out that prisons are probably the safest most secure freest of toilet wine places on earth.

Terry Melanson
5/22/2020 10:46:28 am

If I write about Epstein I'll be sure to cite who was first to bring attention to what piece of evidence. I'm meticulous about things like that and have reams of articles and web pages saved on my computer from those days when everyone was investigating him and his life. My own contribution will be to what extent had his membership in both the Council on Foreign Relations and the Trilateral Commission aided his ascendancy into the elite stratosphere. I have all the membership lists, year by year, for the CFR beginning in 1922 and most of the Trlateral membership lists since its founding in 1973. He joined both think tanks in 1995 and was a member in both until 2008. The corporate boards who fund these orgs are important as well.

Joe Scales
5/22/2020 10:59:32 am

"There you go again, Mr. Scales. You have attempted to counter detailed posts of mine with a few one-liners."

That is because it only takes a line or two to debunk your argumentum verbosum; which of course is yet another informal fallacy you embrace quite frequently on this board. What's rather amusing about it, is that it's actually a form of bullying.

As if Nerd. As if...

An Anonymous Nerd
5/22/2020 12:48:35 pm

[insert latest read-alike Joe Scales post]

Facts and reason take time and space. Bunk is easier and, sadly, has a wider audience. Oh well. I'll stick with facts and reason, just the same.

-An Anonymous Nerd

An Anonymous Nerd
5/22/2020 12:51:47 pm

[This is the first I'm hearing of Mrs. Clinton being tied to Epstein's murder]

She's not tied to it, and no it's not the first you've heard of it. The President of the United States even promoted this fantasy.

https://thehill.com/homenews/administration/456979-trump-retweets-post-promoting-conspiracy-theory-about-jeffrey

[so I wonder how widespread this theory actually is. ]

Ain't no theory, it's a meme and article of faith among Conservatives. See above.

-An Anonymous Nerd

Kent
5/22/2020 03:44:03 pm

Mr. Anonymous:

WRONG.

It IS the first I've heard of it.

YOU don't get to tell ME it's NOT the first I've heard of it.

"Ain't no theory, it's a meme and article of faith among Conservatives."

That just sounds like nonsense.

Oh, the things I would have said to you in the old days...

Joe Scales
5/23/2020 08:54:14 am

"Facts and reason take time and space. Bunk is easier and, sadly, has a wider audience. Oh well. I'll stick with facts and reason, just the same."

You've accused me of using informal fallacies over the years and not one single accusation of same has stuck. The square blocks you continue to pound into the round holes of your play workbench. Meanwhile, I point out several such informal fallacies that you have used in this very discussion. All accurate. All have stuck. So it's only natural that you'd need to spend more time on your facts and reason; fruitless as such an endeavor would be for you.

Jim
5/23/2020 10:37:17 am

"You've accused me of using informal fallacies over the years and not one single accusation of same has stuck."

Now Joe, I beg to differ, and I think you would find if a poll were taken here, the vast majority would agree with Mr. Nerd"s assessments of your fallacies.

Perhaps others will chime in ?

Joe Scales
5/24/2020 09:50:19 am

Well Jim, considering that argumentum ad populum is yet another informal fallacy, your vote would certainly not be an educated one in this regard. Given that fact, no need to call on your "friends" either...

Jim
5/24/2020 01:50:02 pm

Well Joe, your argument that nothing has stuck is irrelevant.
Fact is Mr. Nerds arguments need not "stick" to be accurate.
The proof is in the pudding
Let's add a little stickum so we can get a better grip on them:

http://www.jasoncolavito.com/blog/jack-safratti-claims-ufos-are-time-machines-powered-by-metamaterials

An Anonymous Nerd:

"I'll start with an instance where you promoted a wild conspiracy fantasy, in order to support President Trump and the Republican party.
In a reply to this post:
http://www.jasoncolavito.com/blog/the-same-russian-troll-accounts-tweeting-election-propaganda-were-also-tweeting-about-ufos-and-ancient-mysteries

you peddled a wild conspiracy theory regarding the Russian hacking of the DNC. You did the same here:

http://www.jasoncolavito.com/blog/friends-of-david-wilcock-say-he-resigned-from-gaia-tv-over-bad-pay-poor-working-conditions-and-lucifer

except there I also debunked it.

In this post:

http://www.jasoncolavito.com/blog/survey-how-would-you-like-to-see-this-blog-handle-comments

and this post:

http://www.jasoncolavito.com/blog/on-anti-semitic-conspiracy-theories

you attempted to argue that Mr. Colavito's refusal to sign onto your love of your favorite reality TV star, President Donald Trump, had somehow made him sloppy. Your doing so in the latter post, wherein Mr. Colavito called President Trump to task for utilizing another wild conspiracy theory to his advantage, is particularly offensive.

You did something similar here.

http://www.jasoncolavito.com/blog/acting-attorney-generals-bigfoot-and-time-travel-claims-plus-kentuckys-governor-blames-zombie-tv-for-mass-shootings

Here's another instance of you defending President Trump, a Fringe figure as I have noted, against a perceived assault by our host, by quoting one of the President's favorite phrases to use against a news outlet that dares challenge him.

http://www.jasoncolavito.com/blog/the-new-york-times-runs-major-feature-on-ancient-aliens-casts-ancient-astronaut-theorists-as-friendly-lovable-rogues-searching-for-god

Oh, and here's one of my favorites, wherein you assert that I would advocate murdering immigrants if I thought they were going to vote Republican (you also defend the President in this one):

http://www.jasoncolavito.com/blog/the-spring-2018-edition-of-alien-con-finds-ancient-aliens-stars-musing-about-humility-opening-star-gates-and-disclosure"

As far as sticking it seems to have stuck with Bezalel:

"Gotta side with Anonymous Nerd here... in order to respond to Mr. Scales usually outrageous hypocrisy requires a step-by-step repudiation. Scales has shown himself to be a right lurching, unhinged fringe participant and overly politically triggered, despite his vociferous objections on this blog.

Never did Scales defend the actions of Obama to the level that he jumps to the defense of Trump whenever his idiotic behavior, antics or mouth spew comes into play.

Scales to Colavito: “Leave politics out of your review unless it involves criticizing the left”

Kent
5/24/2020 05:46:12 pm

James,

One could say that your malapropism proofs the rule that the proof of the pudding is in the eating. Sadly it was a tldr situation.

Kent
5/25/2020 12:40:59 am

"Never did Scales defend the actions of Obama"

Perhaps because Obama wasn't regularly being vilified on the thinnest basis of the most tenuous imaginary connections to fringe views by the host?

Since you seem to have finally accepted that this site does have a Search function I look forward to your providing a list of such occasions, James. Take all the time you need.

Joe Scales
5/25/2020 09:53:34 am

Kent,
Jim does not understand what an "informal fallacy" is. Now that it's in quotes, he can no doubt google the concept. I'm sure that now properly motivated, he'll be back after some quick perusal and believe himself to have some sort of expertise in logic. A detailed post will follow with dozens of examples of illogic he can dig up... you know... because he has the time. But I digress...

When challenged for his reliance upon fallacious reasoning, he goes back to bare allegations with links to discussion neither he nor Nerd could comprehend; due to both their biases and inherent limitations. Jim. Jim. Jim. No one is going back to search those discussions. But you know this, don't you Jim. That's why you can continue to spread the lie Jim. The conspiracy theory of your own making.

Just stop Jim. This was never a good look for you.

Joe Scales
5/25/2020 09:59:03 am

"Perhaps because Obama wasn't regularly being vilified on the thinnest basis of the most tenuous imaginary connections to fringe views by the host?"

Isn't is fascinating at times, when the obvious escapes the view of the partisan. It's been almost four years and they've never figured that one out. Shame on you... spoiler!

Dr. Twigley on Quitter
5/21/2020 04:49:53 pm

Just so we're clear, the "Dr. Quigley" on Twitter isn't the guy from Georgetown who died in 1977. And he's for darn sure no Cincinnatus.

https://www.conspiracyarchive.com/

Sorry, sell rabbit holes somewhere else.

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          • Miscellaneous Lost Cities
          • The Seven Cities
          • The Lost City of Paititi
          • Manuscript 512
          • The Idolatrous City of Iximaya (Hoax)
          • The 1885 Moberly Lost City Hoax
          • The Elephants of Paredon (Hoax)
        • OOPARTs
        • Oronteus Finaeus Antarctica Map
        • Caucasians in Panama
        • Jefferson's Excavation
        • Fictitious Discoveries in America
        • Against Diffusionism
        • Tunnels Under Peru
        • The Parahyba Inscription (Hoax)
        • Mound Builders
        • Gunung Padang
        • Tales of Enchanted Islands
        • The 1907 Ancient World Map Hoax
        • The 1909 Grand Canyon Hoax
        • The Interglacial Period
        • Solving Oak Island
      • Religious Conspiracies >
        • Pantera, Father of Jesus?
        • Toledot Yeshu
        • Peter of les Vaux-de-Cernay on Cathars
        • Testimony of Jean de Châlons
        • Rosslyn Chapel and the 'Prentice's Pillar
        • The Many Wives of Jesus
        • Templar Infiltration of Labor
        • Louis Martin & the Holy Bloodline
        • The Life of St. Issa (Hoax)
        • On the Person of Jesus Christ
      • Giants in the Earth >
        • Fossil Origins of Myths >
          • Fossil Teeth and Bones of Elephants
          • Fossil Elephants
          • Fossil Bones of Teutobochus
          • Fossil Mammoths and Giants
          • Giants' Bones Dug Out of the Earth
          • Fossils and the Supernatural
          • Fossils, Myth, and Pseudo-History
          • Man During the Stone Age
          • Fossil Bones and Giants
          • American Elephant Myths
          • The Mammoth and the Flood
          • Fossils and Myth
          • Fossil Origin of the Cyclops
          • Mastodon, Mammoth, and Man
        • Fragments on Giants
        • Manichaean Book of Giants
        • Geoffrey on British Giants
        • Alfonso X's Hermetic History of Giants
        • Boccaccio and the Fossil 'Giant'
        • Book of Howth
        • Purchas His Pilgrimage
        • Edmond Temple's 1827 Giant Investigation
        • The Giants of Sardinia
        • Giants and the Sons of God
        • The Magnetism of Evil
        • Tertiary Giants
        • Smithsonian Giant Reports
        • Early American Giants
        • The Giant of Coahuila
        • Jewish Encyclopedia on Giants
        • Index of Giants
        • Newspaper Accounts of Giants
        • Lanier's A Book of Giants
      • Science and History >
        • Halley on Noah's Comet
        • The Newport Tower
        • Iron: The Stone from Heaven
        • Ararat and the Ark
        • Pyramid Facts and Fancies
        • Argonauts before Homer
        • The Deluge
        • Crown Prince Rudolf on the Pyramids
        • Old Mythology in New Apparel
        • Blavatsky on Dinosaurs
        • Teddy Roosevelt on Bigfoot
        • Devil Worship in France
        • Maspero's Review of Akhbar al-zaman
        • The Holy Grail as Lucifer's Crown Jewel
        • The Mutinous Sea
        • The Rock Wall of Rockwall
        • Fabulous Zoology
        • The Origins of Talos
        • Mexican Mythology
        • Chinese Pyramids
        • Maqrizi's Names of the Pharaohs
      • Extreme History >
        • Roman Empire Hoax
        • American Antiquities
        • American Cataclysms
        • England, the Remnant of Judah
        • Historical Chronology of the Mexicans
        • Maspero on the Predynastic Sphinx
        • Vestiges of the Mayas
        • Ragnarok: The Age of Fire and Gravel
        • Origins of the Egyptian People
        • The Secret Doctrine >
          • Volume 1: Cosmogenesis
          • Volume 2: Anthropogenesis
        • Phoenicians in America
        • The Electric Ark
        • Traces of European Influence
        • Prince Henry Sinclair
        • Pyramid Prophecies
        • Templars of Ancient Mexico
        • Chronology and the "Riddle of the Sphinx"
        • The Faith of Ancient Egypt
        • Spirit of the Hour in Archaeology
        • Book of the Damned
        • Great Pyramid As Noah's Ark
        • Richard Shaver's Proofs
    • Alien Encounters >
      • US Government Ancient Astronaut Files >
        • Fortean Society and Columbus
        • Inquiry into Shaver and Palmer
        • The Skyfort Document
        • Whirling Wheels
        • Denver Ancient Astronaut Lecture
        • Soviet Search for Lemuria
        • Visitors from Outer Space
        • Unidentified Flying Objects (Abstract)
        • "Flying Saucers"? They're a Myth
        • UFO Hypothesis Survival Questions
        • Air Force Academy UFO Textbook
        • The Condon Report on Ancient Astronauts
        • Atlantis Discovery Telegrams
        • Ancient Astronaut Society Telegram
        • Noah's Ark Cables
        • The Von Daniken Letter
        • CIA Psychic Probe of Ancient Mars
        • Scott Wolter Lawsuit
        • UFOs in Ancient China
        • CIA Report on Noah's Ark
        • CIA Noah's Ark Memos
        • Congressional Ancient Aliens Testimony
        • Ancient Astronaut and Nibiru Email
        • Congressional Ancient Mars Hearing
        • House UFO Hearing
      • Ancient Extraterrestrials >
        • Premodern UFO Sightings
        • The Moon Hoax
        • Inhabitants of Other Planets
        • Blavatsky on Ancient Astronauts
        • The Stanzas of Dzyan (Hoax)
        • Aerolites and Religion
        • What Is Theosophy?
        • Plane of Ether
        • The Adepts from Venus
      • A Message from Mars
      • Saucer Mystery Solved?
      • Orville Wright on UFOs
      • Interdimensional Flying Saucers
      • Flying Saucers Are Real
      • Report on UFOs
    • The Supernatural >
      • The Devils of Loudun
      • Sublime and Beautiful
      • Voltaire on Vampires
      • Demonology and Witchcraft
      • Thaumaturgia
      • Bulgarian Vampires
      • Religion and Evolution
      • Transylvanian Superstitions
      • Defining a Zombie
      • Dread of the Supernatural
      • Vampires
      • Werewolves and Vampires and Ghouls
      • Science and Fairy Stories
      • The Cursed Car
    • Classic Fiction >
      • Lucian's True History
      • Some Words with a Mummy
      • The Coming Race
      • King Solomon's Mines
      • An Inhabitant of Carcosa
      • The Xipéhuz
      • Lot No. 249
      • The Novel of the Black Seal
      • The Island of Doctor Moreau
      • Pharaoh's Curse
      • Edison's Conquest of Mars
      • The Lost Continent
      • Count Magnus
      • The Mysterious Stranger
      • The Wendigo
      • Sredni Vashtar
      • The Lost World
      • The Red One
      • H. P. Lovecraft >
        • Dagon
        • The Call of Cthulhu
        • History of the Necronomicon
        • At the Mountains of Madness
        • Lovecraft's Library in 1932
      • The Skeptical Poltergeist
      • The Corpse on the Grating
      • The Second Satellite
      • Queen of the Black Coast
      • A Martian Odyssey
    • Classic Genre Movies
    • Miscellaneous Documents >
      • The Balloon-Hoax
      • A Problem in Greek Ethics
      • The Migration of Symbols
      • The Gospel of Intensity
      • De Profundis
      • The Life and Death of Crown Prince Rudolf
      • The Bathtub Hoax
      • Crown Prince Rudolf's Letters
      • Position of Viking Women
      • Employment of Homosexuals
      • James Dean's Scrapbook
      • James Dean's Love Letters
      • The Amazing James Dean Hoax!
    • Free Classic Pseudohistory eBooks
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