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Review of "Gods, Man, & War 2: Man" by Tom DeLonge with Peter Levenda

12/3/2019

27 Comments

 
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Gods, Man, & War 2: Man
Tom DeLonge with Peter Levenda | To the Stars… | 2019 | 460 pages | ISBN: 978-1-943272-37-2 | c. $25
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When I was young, I thought the apocryphal words of the Caliph Omar on the burning of the Library of Alexandria to be horrible. “If these books agree with the Koran, they are useless; if they disagree, they are pernicious: in either case, they ought to be destroyed.” While the religious sentiment still strikes me as offensive, the older I get the more I have come to realize that too many books are bullshit in dust jackets. Would we really be worse off if books that were full of lies were sent to be pulped and those that added nothing new to the store of human knowledge were never written? Currently, publishers print more than 100,000 titles each year, and 99% of them are read by almost no one. We could do with fewer, and the newest volume of Gods, Man, & War could easily have joined the pile of worthless volumes that would have made the world a better place for not existing.
Gods, Man, & War 2: Man
Gods, Man, & War 2: Man is officially credited to Tom DeLonge with longtime writer on occult themes Peter Levenda credited only as writing “with” DeLonge, but there is no evidence anywhere in the book of DeLonge’s voice, and in a couple of places Levenda seems to slip into describing the work as his own. I have no reason to doubt that Levenda, active since the 1970s, wrote the vast majority, if not the entirety, of the text. That also accounts for the musty smell of the 1970s that hangs over the whole book. In truth, it would probably have been one of the better UFO books of the 1970s, but today it is a weird throwback to another time.

My review of volume 1 in the series, Gods, can be found here (Part 1, Part 2, and Part 3).
 
Before we discuss the actual content of the volume 2, I need to say a word about the book itself. The books handsomely produced with an attractive production design, good quality paper, and a light but sturdy hardcover binding. This does not, however, mask the inadequacies in To the Stars Academy of Arts and Science’s adventure in self-publishing. The book is riddled with the kinds of amateur errors that a professional publisher would have taken care of, and the text is marred with stylistic inconsistencies, awkward editing choices, and the kind of authorial self-indulgence that a major publisher would have edited out. The company employed a copyeditor, but the errors were noticeable.
 
This doesn’t even get into the simple problems of usage and fact-checking. The title, as you might have noticed, follows a midcentury throwback to the old way of using “man” as a synecdoche for “humanity,” and older, less inclusive language tends to litter the text. This doesn’t bother me per se, but it contributes to the dated feeling of the book, alongside the pop culture references to movies and TV from the 1970s and 1980s that were before my time.
 
More importantly: This book is full of basic fact-checking errors, speaking to the author’s (or authors’) ignorance, laziness, or both. Let me give one example that stands for them all. On page 48, Levenda says that reality is fungible and that the very term “real” is “problematic” because it derives from the Indo-European world that gave us both the English “real” and the Spanish “real” (meaning “royal”), thus “‘reality’ was whatever the ‘royal’ said it was.” Ugh. If you are going to construct a sociological theory based on etymology, at least be better at it than Isidore of Seville, who notoriously just made up whatever he wanted to teach a moral lesson. Real in English comes from a French word ultimately from the Latin res, or “thing,” as in something tangible. The Spanish real that we are talking about in this particular usage (“royal”) derives from regalis, from the Latin rex (“king”), which comes from an unrelated Indo-European root for moving in a straight line, i.e., to lead. Levenda has conflated the Spanish real meaning “royal,” from a contraction of regalis, with the unrelated Spanish real meaning “real,” which is indeed from the Latin res like its English counterpart. His superficial patina of learning leads him down questionable paths he obviously doesn’t understand. Everyone makes mistakes, but the worse part is that these errors happen over and over in the book, and no one cared. A mistake is forgivable; not caring to check before building arguments on them repeatedly is not.
 
To that end, it isn’t really useful to try to critique the book point for point as I often do with these sorts of tomes. So much of the material is half-baked, half-understood, and poorly reasoned that the larger arguments are rendered nonsensical because they rest on pillars of sand. Add to that the author’s (or “authors’”) assumption that the reader is already a believer in what TTSA (or, as they apparently now stylized it, according to this book, TTSAAS) call “the Phenomenon” and also agree on the multipronged nature of said phenomenon, cutting across ufology, the occult, the supernatural, and the paranormal, and you have a recipe for a book that made little sense even to me, and I know much more about the subject than most readers who are not themselves professional ufologists.
 
Part of the problem is that Levenda doesn’t keep the reader in mind. Consider the book’s first words, in all their un-copyedited glory: “At this time there has been renewed public interest in robots…”. Compelling! It’s like that throughout the GM&W2, which reads like a high-schooler’s passive voice book report rather than an effort to tell a story or engage with readers.
 
Anyway, the content isn’t much better.
 
The book begins with questions about machines and consciousness and then starts speculating about whether alien anal probes are the work of robot aliens rather than living ones. It’s always lovely to see the influence of my own work on these kinds of products, but when Levenda offers two pages attempting to rebut my article comparing the Betty and Barney Hill hypnosis sessions to episodes of The Outer Limits and The Twilight Zone that aired immediately prior to those hypnosis sessions, he could at least have done me the courtesy of mentioning my name. (I know it’s my version he’s trying to rebut because I’m the one who expanded the comparison beyond Marvin Kottmeyer’s initial identification of a single image in one episode of The Outer Limits, and Levenda addresses my more expansive view.) Levenda discounts my comparison on the grounds (paralleling those used by Stanton Friedman against Kottmeyer) that (a) there is no evidence that the Hills watched these shows, (b) they were unlikely to lie about it, and (c) even if they did interpret their experiences through science fiction, that doesn’t negate their underlying reality. Part of that is logically correct, but when you strip away enough of the accretions from science fiction, the remaining experience—they lost some time in 1961 and were bothered by it three years later—doesn’t add up to alien abduction. That part, which correlates nearly 1:1 with the specific shows airing for three weeks before Barney’s hypnosis session, strongly implies it is a hypnosis-induced fantasy.
 
Levenda, building on the “work” of novelist-turned-occultist Whitley Strieber, tries to spin a conspiracy that alien abductions are part of a larger occult war on humanity and that the media have been complicit in covering it up. His evidence, though, is his own highly selective memories of his salad days in the 1970s and 1980s. Chapter 2, for example, discusses pop culture in the 1970s and 1980s in terms of “The Phenomenon,” and the authors write about sci-fi films of those years such as Close Encounters and E.T.:  “We were being told that the alien presence on Earth actually may be benign.” Malevolent entities, he said, were confined to “another genre,” occult horror like The Omen and The Exorcist. These demons are actually aliens, and vice versa. Stop for a moment and consider the disingenuousness of that argument. Does he not remember movies like Alien, Predator, The Thing, etc. Evil aliens were definitely a thing in the 1970s and 1980s. Worse for him: Many of these aliens, like those of Alien, The Thing, and so on, either gestated within human beings or masqueraded as them, thematically hitting us over the head with a demand to read the alien as something within us, not in some other dimension.
 
Levenda has a penchant for mistaking his own experiences for a human universal. It’s probably why he uses his own limited and unimaginative experience of dreaming to discount the notion that abduction narratives are related to the waking dreams of sleep paralysis. He has never had a realistic dream, so he doesn’t believe it possible. I have, so I do.
 
Another stupid claim was Levenda’s speculation that MJ-12 isn’t a hoax but a “cryptonym” just one letter removed from MK-ULTRA and therefore MK-ULTRA was an “outgrowth” of MJ-12. Ugh. Fake codes within codes, all based on imaginary alphabet conspiracies.
 
It’s this kind of slipshod, superficial argument that makes it difficult to critique the book as a whole since its superstructure rests on these sorts of cheap, false claims. To that end, Levenda comes exquisitely close to declaring that the official position of TTSA is that “aliens” (i.e. “The Phenomenon”) is not extraterrestrial but is in fact demonic. He writes about encounters with angels, demons, and djinn (Arabian supernatural spirits both good and evil), and he happily concludes that were “aliens” actually extraterrestrial biological entities (henceforth EBEs), they would treat us as badly as we treat termites and would care nothing for our welfare, but since they care about us, for good or ill, they must be supernatural entities. (Clearly, he does not have pets, nor has he visited a farm.) He decides that early modern witches had supernatural contact with The Phenomenon, and therefore “aliens” must share similar powers to demons. Etc. etc.
 
I saw this diabolizing of ufology coming in TTSA’s earlier statements, but here the effort to remake UFOs as a subset of parapsychology and therefore the occult is heavy-handed, and unpersuasive. Beneath the effort, Levenda is not shy about admitting that he expects TTSA to uncover proof that the supernatural (in the guise of “The Phenomenon”) has an objective reality beyond the bounds of scientific materialism and therefore … well, you know the rest. If the supernatural is real, then the atheists are wrong. If Satan exists, then God must be real. Hell proves Heaven and saves us all. He even declares being abducted and anally probed to be “redemptive”! To that end, Levenda, in all seriousness, devotes several pages to the question of whether aliens and angels have knees and therefore whether standing is a sign of divinity. And of course it wouldn’t be a UFO book without references to Enoch, Oannes, and the Watchers/Sons of God. Those pesky Watchers are the mediators between ufologists and the divine, and ufology seems desperate to prove them real in the hope that it will give us proof of God. It doesn’t work that way, though, any more than the existence of Plato proves the reality of Atlantis. Even if the Watchers really existed (in their angelic form), it wouldn’t necessarily mean that Yahweh existed in the form described in the Bible.
 
Once you recognize the underlying belief that aliens = demons and therefore the quest for UFO secrets is really a search for God, the rest of the book’s seemingly unwieldy assortment of claims becomes explicable. Levenda’s weird idea that in the modern period the Catholic Church held some sort of “authoritarian will over the people” reflects his hope to find a neo-pagan faith less restrictive than conservative forces of Christianity. But the Catholic Church didn’t even have authoritarian control in the limited sphere of Western Europe during the Middle Ages (witness the power struggle between the popes and the Holy Roman Emperors, for example), much less the whole world even after the Reformation. It explains, too, Levenda’s ahistorical claim that science if a form of religion and that science replaced the Church as handmaiden of government. And it explains why Levenda actually agrees with me (!) that what we call the “UFO phenomenon” is not singular in nature and is most likely human beings projecting their cultural assumptions onto ambiguous phenomena. I outlined my view on this in 2013, but Levenda differs in not going as far as I in following the logic to its is necessary conclusion. Instead, he stops short and assumes that all of the aspects of “the Phenomenon” are paranormal.
 
I guess that’s why he claims that “sadly” the “Atacama skeleton”—the stillborn fetus stolen from its grave and marketed as a space alien by ufologists—turned out to be human. It’s probably also why he tries to analogize his view of semi-divine aliens interfering with humans by imagining future humans remembering the Holocaust as a battle between two sets of “gods” over the destruction of Jews until only “a small percentage” were saved. The analogy is weird and offensive, but he justifies it in terms of allowing him to follow Zecharia Sitchin in reinterpreting Babylonian stories as alien genocides. He name-checks Sitchin and basically endorses Sitchin Studies, minus the literal emphasis on gold-mining.
 
I feel like I should talk about Levenda’s long middle section on genetics and whether human DNA reflects extraterrestrial codes, but it’s all window dressing. Big chunks of this sections are devoted to evaluating religious ideas about human suffering, creation narratives, and the afterlife. A particularly bizarre section offers a lukewarm endorsement of evolutionary theory, praises Intelligent Design as a “compromise,” and compares it to the ancient astronaut theory of directed panspermia (aliens shooting meteors full of DNA to Earth to kick-start life) before complaining angrily that “ideology is permitted to drive the search for knowledge.” It isn’t clear at all which ideology he is complaining about, but his defense in that same section of remote viewing and hunting for flying space demons while deriding scientists as “high priests” of materialism suggests that he thinks rather little of mainstream materialist science. He seems to be advocating for some kind of neo-pagan New Age spirituality under the guise of anti-materialist space-poltergeist-based “science.”
 
The rest of this long, multichapter detour into genetics is similarly littered with attempts to find religious and occult traditions buried in the “code” he thinks space-demons built into our DNA, or that are parallel to DNA, or something like that. These include the I Jing and John Dee’s Angelic Tablets. He basically discovered math and was amazed that it exists in more than one place. He also assumes that ancient depictions of entwined snakes represent the DNA double helix, which makes just as much sense as claiming my slipper represents a paramecium just because they have vaguely similar shapes. And just for kicks, he adds that the chessboard represents a “matrix” for the “genetic code” and that war is inherent in our demon/alien DNA.
 
None of this speculation finds any actual factual support in Levenda’s book, only recycled claims from Ancient Aliens that he once again seems not to recognize have been part of the ancient astronaut theory for four decades or so and have long been debunked.
 
There is a chapter on “the human female” and the “unique” toll of menstruation and childbirth, which he describes as a “war” between mother one side and father and child on the other. It descends into an embarrassing raft of sexist stereotypes straight from a 1950s Dianetics manual, and he makes an unsupported assertion that a one-night stand produces a “weaker” fetus than a committed relationship due to “certain genetic traits” that are only present in a conception via committed relationship. That is not how genetics work. A sperm cell cannot rearrange its genetic material depending on the father’s future choice whether to call the mother for a second date—“in fact this is the prevailing belief among biologists today,” Levenda writes. I assume he is confusing genetics with a grossly oversimplified view of epigenetics, but he gave no sources, so I have no idea what he was thinking.
 
The second half of the book covers consciousness, and there is really very little I can say here since the arguments are primarily philosophical rather than scientific. Where Levenda does delve into science, he is out of his depth, and some of the questions he asks are bizarre. He wonders, for example, if DNA is conscious, or if it produces consciousness. The overarching argument he tries to make is that the human brain is a receiver for “signals” from alien-demons and that we may be thought-forms that pop into this reality. Or maybe not. Honestly, this half of the book was dull, a sort of book report on current scientific studies of consciousness layered on top of an underlying effort to return to Cartesian dualism in the hope that extracting consciousness from the body will create room for spirit worlds and so on. He wants to see consciousness as a sort of anti-material pantheism, so that our nervous systems simply receive a partial signal representing a fragment of the divine whole. It’s warmed over New Age nonsense of the kind Levenda reveled in when he was young and wild and free and beyond good and evil. With strange aeons, even death may die, and all that. But don’t take my word for it. Levenda says it himself: “So, lurking behind all the science and the math, the physics and the biochemistry, and even behind the space program itself, is the ancient dream of the mystics and the gurus: a spiritual regeneration of the human being… .”
 
Finally, in this section, he starts to give the game away. Amidst his efforts to refute “materialist” understandings of consciousness, he concedes that alien-demons aren’t operating in this reality but instead occupy a non-material plane accessible through inner voyages into our own consciousness—i.e. the shamanic trips to meet gods and monsters that Graham Hancock goes on about when he is tripping on ayahuasca. Levenda shades into darker territory when he speculates—without evidence—that unseen powers manipulate quantum mechanics to induce alien-themed hallucinations in our minds (because conscious genes apparently react to quantum stimuli) so that the Phenomenon may be a “control mechanism” of some supernatural origin:

What we propose is that the alien abduction experience is real in some way: It is the host of an actual experience that involves an external actor or actors, beings whose ability to manipulate consciousness is without parallel, but an ability that human beings are soon to acquire. That these beings are ordinarily invisible to us, that they seem like genies or sprites or ghosts or devils, should compel us to ask deeper questions about the experience and not write it off as the product of an overactive imagination, or hysteria, or mental disorder.
A final section of the book, largely unrelated to anything that came before, discusses cyborg technology, artificial intelligence, and ESP, with ample coverage of Levenda’s patron saint, Helena Blavatsky, and Tom DeLonge’s business partner, longtime psychical researcher Hal Puthoff. It’s mostly irrelevant except that Levenda uses it to justify the inclusion of dead humans among the aliens, for if consciousness survives death, whether as a ghost or a ghost in a machine (internet-uploaded consciousness), then we are the aliens and they are we, and all of the various supernatural creatures are simply machines (i.e. artificial constructions) to penetrate into hidden realms of our own consciousness.” The only question, he says, is whether we create aliens and angels ourselves or whether a force beyond us does.
 
So, there you have it: The great secret of the TTSA Sekret Machines series is just this: that the only topic worth exploring is ourselves, that ego trumps all, and that the whole of the universe is contained only in our own self-interested self-obsession. Levenda’s book might be steeped in 1970s and 1980s material, but there is nothing so quintessentially modern as the reduction of the entirety of each individual’s existence to, basically, the quest for the perfect internal selfie.
 
Levenda also has a persecution complex, which I guess cycles back to his refusal to deal with my arguments in their entirety by caricaturing them into straw men. In an appendix, Levenda crows that books by UFO skeptics don’t sell because “no one is titillated by debunkers” and only “self-congratulatory cynics” want to read about why speculative ideas are wrong. I assume he was again thinking in part of me when he claimed “skeptics” misrepresent believers and make fun of them. He claims that a “scientific inquisition” equivalent to Torquemada’s tortures works tirelessly to “prove the weaknesses and probe the vulnerabilities” of TTSA’s claims. That’s called science, but for Levenda, the idea of falsifiability is a relic of the materialist worldview that denies what is truly important, spending out time contemplating ourselves. He also decries the null hypothesis as an unfair burden, misunderstanding it as “working backward” from a belief that the paranormal isn’t real. It’s up to the advocate to prove that it is, to the highest standards, and he doesn’t feel that’s fair. He fears that “debunking” is only “one step removed” from “attacking religion in general.” Oh, the horror! This leads into a truly bizarre rant in which Levenda spends many pages attacking New Atheist authors, specifically Sam Harris (a thinker whose thoughts I have often said ought to be kept to himself) while both condemning the Church for its suppression of the occult and defending it as the keeper of the supernatural flame. He concludes that spirituality (though not dogmatic religion) is good, secularism is bad, and GOD GOD GOD OH GOD WE NEED GOD I LOVE GOD! Or something close to that. It’s a cri de coeur in the form of a treatise on the evils of secular humanism. It ought to be required reading for anyone who supports TTSA before they endorse the company’s bonkers version of “science.”
 
Ultimately, GM&W2: Man is the out-of-touch ramblings of an author forty years past his prime, looking to justify his hope that mortality is not the end and praying that UFOs are the secret immortality machines to justify his faith. That this is the best To the Stars Academy can produce and the defining vision statement for their view of the Phenomenon is profoundly sad and unquestionably hilarious. The danger is that the company’s faithful will believe it.
27 Comments
Accident
12/3/2019 10:31:22 am

Life is an accident
That's why there's no life anywhere else outside Planet Earth

Reply
David Evans
12/4/2019 06:48:51 am

Because there can only be one accident?

Reply
Frank
12/3/2019 10:51:32 am

Good Grief! Charlie Brown or Jason Colavito, author.

"When I was young, I thought the apocryphal words of the Caliph Omar on the burning of the Library of Alexandria to be horrible. “If these books agree with the Koran, they are useless; if they disagree, they are pernicious: in either case, they ought to be destroyed.” While the religious sentiment still strikes me as offensive, the older I get the more I have come to realize that too many books are bullshit in dust jackets."

OK "Waldo", we hear you asking: Where are the elephants?....I want to see elephants! Oh my dear Jason, if you could only really understand Plato, you'd be able to see all those "elephants" of Atlantis. Those that have placed virtue second to material wealth are your elephants...the GOP and all Trump supporters are your poor visionaries.....poor-sighted elephants.

AMONG secular books, Plato only is entitled to Omar's fanatical compliment to the Koran, when he said, "Burn the libraries; for their value is in this book." These sentences contain the culture of nations; these are the corner-stone of schools; these are the fountain-head of literatures. A discipline it is in logic, arithmetic, taste, symmetry, poetry, language, rhetoric, ontology, morals or practical wisdom. There was never such range of speculation. Out of Plato come all things that are still written and debated among men of thought. Great havoc makes he among our originalities. We have reached the mountain from which all these drift boulders were detached. The Bible of the learned for twenty-two hundred years, every brisk young man who says in succession fine things to each reluctant generation,- Boethius, Rabelais, Erasmus, Bruno, Locke, Rousseau, Alfieri, Coleridge,- is some reader of Plato, translating into the vernacular, wittily, his good things. Even the men of grander proportion suffer some deduction from the misfortune (shall I say?) of coming after this exhausting generalizer. St. Augustine, Copernicus, Newton, Behmen, Swedenborg, Goethe, are likewise his debtors and must say after him. For it is fair to credit the broadest generalizer with all the particulars deducible from his thesis.

Plato is philosophy, and philosophy, Plato,- at once the glory and the shame of mankind, since neither Saxon nor Roman have availed to add any idea to his categories. No wife, no children had he, and the thinkers of all civilized nations are his posterity and are tinged with his mind. How many great men Nature is incessantly sending up out of night, to be his men,- Platonists! the Alexandrians, a constellation of genius; the Elizabethans, not less; Sir Thomas More, Henry More, John Hales, John Smith, Lord Bacon, Jeremy Taylor, Ralph Cudworth, Sydenham, Thomas Taylor; Marcilius Ficinus and Picus Mirandola. Calvinism is in his Phaedo: Christianity is in it. Mahometanism draws all its philosophy, in its hand-book of morals, the Akhlak-y-Jalaly, from him. Mysticism finds in Plato all its texts. This citizen of a town in Greece is no villager nor patriot. An Englishman reads and says, "how English!" a German- "how Teutonic!" an Italian- "how Roman and how Greek!" As they say that Helen of Argos had that universal beauty that every body felt related to her, so Plato seems to a reader in New England an American genius. His broad humanity transcends all sectional lines.





Reply
Plato is philosophy, and philosophy, Plato
12/3/2019 10:55:44 am

And Plato was a paedophile

Reply
Frank
12/3/2019 12:35:11 pm

Apparently you did not understand the intent of my post, as it relates to Jason, an author himself, and his dramatic citing opening of the book review.

And as far as what you posted, I fail to see any connections to Jason's words in the book review, nor to my post directed at Jason.

However, I have taken some trouble to address your misconception by citing an old reference still available.

"And Plato was a paedophile" Your opinion? From whence it comes?" False rumors you have fallen for, I would say. Apparently you have not read Plato, and/or do not understand Plato either.

To the Editor:

In "What Plato Says" (letter, Feb. 13), Catherine Glass suggests that Phaedrus in the "Symposium" says what Plato thought. This gets Phaedrus and Plato wrong, for Phaedrus is praising pederasty, not homosexual intercourse in general, and Plato condemns homosexual intercourse in both the "Laws" and the "Republic." The "Laws" (Book VIII) rejects homosexual intercourse because it can render men unfit for marriage and because it is contrary to nature and a shameless indulgence.

The "Laws" recommends that homosexuality, like adultery, fornication and the use of prostitutes, not be engaged in; that if it is engaged in, it be kept private or closeted, and that if it is discovered, it be punished by deprivation of civil rights, a severe penalty. In effect, the "Laws" recommends criminalization.

In the speeches of Phaedrus and others in the "Symposium" Plato portrays Athenian attitudes of the fifth century B.C. to pederasty, but those attitudes were not his own, nor those of Socrates. R. E. ALLEN Prof. of Classics, Northwestern U. Evanston, Ill., Feb. 14, 1993

https://www.nytimes.com/1993/02/27/opinion/l-plato-on-homosexuality-238493.html

Joe Scales
12/3/2019 12:49:08 pm

"Apparently you did not understand the intent of my post, as it relates to Jason, an author himself, and his dramatic citing opening of the book review. "

I was more put off by the seeming willingness to burn books. And why? Because they're full of crap or because no one reads them? If the former, there's that whole free speech thing. If it's the latter... well, Jason has some books coming out soon himself. I'm willing to bet that the accuracy and importance of which for him isn't dependent upon mass sales.

Plato is philosophy, and philosophy, Plato
12/3/2019 12:53:37 pm

Dorothea Wender, "Plato: Misogynist, Paedophile, and Feminist

Plato is philosophy, and philosophy, Plato
12/3/2019 01:00:14 pm

http://perseus.uchicago.edu/perseus-cgi/citequery3.pl?dbname=GreekFeb2011&getid=1&query=Pl.%20Symp.%20192b

Jason Colavito link
12/3/2019 01:01:41 pm

Are we all this literal? I'm not saying to burn books. I'm saying that too many turn out to be wastes of time, offer nothing of value, and shouldn't have been written or published in the first place. Discretion is the better part of valor--i.e., think before you write.

TONY S.
12/3/2019 03:01:49 pm

No reasonably intelligent person who’s been coming here and following your blog for any decent amount of time can seriously believe you advocated burning books with what you wrote above. You’re someone who loves knowledge and research, and a bibliophile with his own extensive library. Such people don’t believe in the burning of books. But they do have higher than average standards when it comes to what is and isn’t worthy of being written down and preserved. I can relate, I’m the same as you.


Even someone not familiar with you who possesses average reading comprehension skills wouldn’t have interpreted your words that way, because that’s clearly not what you wrote.

Jim
12/3/2019 03:19:36 pm

"The book begins with questions about machines and consciousness and then starts speculating about whether alien anal probes are the work of robot aliens rather than living ones."

Has anyone seen my Bic lighter ?

Joe Scales
12/3/2019 05:11:37 pm

"Are we all this literal? I'm not saying to burn books."

You're partly correct. You dreamed of pulping them within the context of book burning. And I suppose if you want to be literal yourself, I did say "seeming willingness". Point being, like Frank I found your opening lacking, but for different reason. Still, that seeming willingness might be somewhat revealing. Yours to ponder.

TONY S.
12/3/2019 12:21:48 pm

“...pop culture references to movies and TV from the 1970s and 1980s that were before my time...”

You’re making me feel old, Jason!

When did this idea that ufos and aliens are really angels and demons begin? I don’t remember that being a part of the ufo culture of the 1970s or 80s. Outside of Von Daniken I don’t even remember religion being associated with the topic at all. Is it a more recent notion begun by the Ancient Aliens crowd? Just curious.

Reply
Jason Colavito link
12/3/2019 12:32:26 pm

Well, there were the UFO preachers of the 1950s and 1960s who argued UFOs were angels. They were fringe then, but R. L. Dione's "God Drives a Flying Saucer" certainly contributed. In the 1980s a lot of evangelicals proposed demon-flown saucers. It's always been in the background, but now seems to be coming to the fore.

Reply
Frank
12/3/2019 12:42:42 pm

Let us not forget the Old Testament's accounts cited by these more modern fringe authorities, such as in Ezekiel.

Homer Sextown
12/3/2019 09:08:52 pm

Often things don't mean what you think they mean:

"Dione wrote God Drives a Flying Saucer in 1969. The book is known for its eccentric claims:

God is not supernatural but is a technologically advanced Ufonaut (Saucerian God)
The angel Gabriel hypnotized Mary and injected her with a hypodermic needle with God's sperm in it
Jesus was born by artificial insemination
Extraterrestrial visitation from aliens is common in both the Old and New Testament
Ezekiels visions were hallucinations caused by UFOS
UFOS are God's messengers
God is immortal through technology
Heaven is a supertechnological society
All miracles are to be explained by flying saucer technology
The human brain is akin to a radio: it can receive and emit electromagnetic signals
The star over Bethlehem was a luminous flying saucer"

https://baker.ink/library/ultimate_woo_woo/Magical_Library/God%20Drives%20A%20Flying%20Saucer%20-%20R.L.%20Dione.pdf

https://baker.ink/library/ultimate_woo_woo/Magical_Library/

Parallels in Bible
12/4/2019 05:56:29 am

Everything about Flying Saucers has its parallel in the Bible, although authors like R. L. Dione take it the completely wrong way.

Angels are counterpart to extra-terrestrial aliens, but that does not mean angels were somehow ufonauts.

There is absolutely no difference between pseudo-histories and religions - they all originate from the same place.

There is no difference between The Bible and Chariots of the Gods.

Jessup
12/3/2019 12:43:27 pm

Morris K. Jessup, UFO and The Bible (Citadel Press: New York, 1956)

Reply
Kal
12/3/2019 02:02:15 pm

So, the book contradicts itself by claiming the Hill case was real, and also that it was an hallucination, or other cases were brought on by false dreams? Drugs naturally entered into this. Streiber also was caught up in the graze of the time, and came up with a narrative that fit the already existing UFO abduction narrative in pop culture.

The scifi of the 1950s did indeed imply space creatures could be angels or demons. It's been around at least until then. Maybe way back in the 30s even.

What a mess of glued together half stories.

Reply
Kent
12/3/2019 02:57:11 pm

If it was meant to be implied that "there has been" is passive a lack of correctness is found there..

`Umar gets a bad rap; the really good Library at Alexandria was destroyed long before the founding of Islam. He destroyed a later edition, if any.

Reply
TONY S.
12/3/2019 03:10:42 pm

Agreed. There were several libraries in Alexandria, including the main one in the Royal District adjoining the Museum, which Julius Caesar accidentally burned. They were all long gone before Islam came to Alexandria.

The story that the Muslims used Alexandrian books as fuel for their fires is just a story.

Reply
Paul
12/3/2019 05:59:04 pm

As for books that should never see the light of day, Wolter is a gift that keeps on giving. 2020 should be a good year for Jason. Sampled some of the recent Freemason podcast Wolter was on, he mentioned he and Mann are working on a series of books. Templars consorting with the Muslims, secret Templar caves in Montana, Kensington Runestone, Mandans, Merriwether Lewis, and a whole lot of other trash, all wrapped up in a neat package. Oh, did I mention Scotty turned down Prometheus four times (from the horses mouth) to be on COI. Says COI is all a fraud, go figure. Apologies for being off topic.

Reply
Joe Scales
12/3/2019 08:59:37 pm

Oak Island does currently have a geologist on hand. I think he once said something like... "this looks like rock". But he's there as they dig for imaginary flood tunnels; flood tunnels that were ruled out over a hundred and fifty years ago by guess what? Geology.

Reply
Kent
12/3/2019 10:16:33 pm

But does their geologist have "enemies" and a direct line to the FBI? I suspect not.

Joe Scales
12/4/2019 10:09:34 am

The irony of Wolter's position on Oak Island, though flawed from the get go as there was never any valid reason to suspect anyone ever buried anything of value there, is that it's actually more reasonable given the origin story. Wolter believes something of value was put there... by Templars, no less... but ultimately retrieved. Now take a look at the treasure tale... boys see mysterious lights on the island, investigate the next day and find a tackle block attached to a tree limb hanging over soft ground. So who buries the Ark of the Covenant and then leaves a tackle block hanging over the dig site? Extreme cleanliness be damned.

Seed Of Bismuth
12/26/2019 02:49:28 pm

Um didn't MK-ULTRA actually exist? they just denied it because they didn't want their agent accountable for their agents doing any random shit that floated their minds?

Reply
Trevor Carter
6/6/2020 10:38:50 am

I've listened to both Peter Levenda and Tom DeLonge discussing the book(s) and their ideas about what the phenomenon is. They don't always seem to be on the same page. Tom said there are multiple races visiting Earth. Peter gravitates more to the spiritual explanation. Having studied the phenomenon for over 20 years I can say that there is nothing new in what they're saying or claiming. There is a real phenomenon, but there's no real evidence to suggest it's extraterrestrial.

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      • Blunders in the Sky
      • The Case of the False Quotes
      • Alternative Authors' Quote Fraud
      • David Childress & the Aliens
      • Faking Ancient Art in Uzbekistan
      • Intimations of Persecution
      • Zecharia Sitchin's World
      • Jesus' Alien Ancestors?
      • Extraterrestrial Evolution?
    • Collection: Skeptic Magazine >
      • America Before Review
      • Native American Discovery of Europe
      • Interview: Scott Sigler
      • Golden Fleeced
      • Oh the Horror
      • Discovery of America
      • Supernatural Television
      • Review of Civilization One
      • Who Lost the Middle Ages
      • Charioteer of the Gods
    • Collection: Ancient History >
      • Prehistoric Nuclear War
      • The China Syndrome
      • Atlantis, Mu, and the Maya
      • Easter Island Exposed
      • Who Built the Sphinx?
      • Who Built the Great Pyramid?
      • Archaeological Cover Up?
    • Collection: The Lovecraft Legacy >
      • Pauwels, Bergier, and Lovecraft
      • Lovecraft in Bergier
      • Lovecraft and Scientology
    • Collection: UFOs >
      • Alien Abduction at the Outer Limits
      • Aliens and Anal Probes
      • Ultra-Terrestrials and UFOs
      • Rebels, Queers, and Aliens
    • Scholomance: The Devil's School
    • Prehistory of Chupacabra
    • The Templars, the Holy Grail, & Henry Sinclair
    • Magicians of the Gods Review
    • The Curse of the Pharaohs
    • The Antediluvian Pyramid Myth
    • Whitewashing American Prehistory
    • James Dean's Cursed Porsche
  • The Library
    • Ancient Mysteries >
      • Ancient Texts >
        • Mesopotamian Texts >
          • Atrahasis Epic
          • Epic of Gilgamesh
          • Kutha Creation Legend
          • Babylonian Creation Myth
          • Descent of Ishtar
          • Berossus
          • Comparison of Antediluvian Histories
        • Egyptian Texts >
          • The Shipwrecked Sailor
          • Dream Stela of Thutmose IV
          • The Papyrus of Ani
          • Classical Accounts of the Pyramids
          • Inventory Stela
          • Manetho
          • Eratosthenes' King List
          • The Story of Setna
          • Leon of Pella
          • Diodorus on Egyptian History
          • On Isis and Osiris
          • Famine Stela
          • Old Egyptian Chronicle
          • The Book of Sothis
          • Horapollo
          • Al-Maqrizi's King List
        • Teshub and the Dragon
        • Hermetica >
          • The Three Hermeses
          • Kore Kosmou
          • Corpus Hermeticum
          • The Asclepius
          • The Emerald Tablet
          • Hermetic Fragments
          • Prologue to the Kyranides
          • The Secret of Creation
          • Ancient Alphabets Explained
          • Prologue to Ibn Umayl's Silvery Water
          • Book of the 24 Philosophers
          • Aurora of the Philosophers
        • Hesiod's Theogony
        • Periplus of Hanno
        • Ctesias' Indica
        • Sanchuniathon
        • Sima Qian
        • Syncellus's Enoch Fragments
        • The Book of Enoch
        • Slavonic Enoch
        • Sepher Yetzirah
        • Tacitus' Germania
        • De Dea Syria
        • Aelian's Various Histories
        • Julius Africanus' Chronography
        • Eusebius' Chronicle
        • Chinese Accounts of Rome
        • Ancient Chinese Automaton
        • The Orphic Argonautica
        • Fragments of Panodorus
        • Annianus on the Watchers
        • The Watchers and Antediluvian Wisdom
      • Medieval Texts >
        • Medieval Legends of Ancient Egypt >
          • Medieval Pyramid Lore
          • John Malalas on Ancient Egypt
          • Fragments of Abenephius
          • Akhbar al-zaman
          • Ibrahim ibn Wasif Shah
          • Murtada ibn al-‘Afif
          • Al-Maqrizi on the Pyramids
          • Al-Suyuti on the Pyramids
        • The Hunt for Noah's Ark
        • Isidore of Seville
        • Book of Liang: Fusang
        • Agobard on Magonia
        • Book of Thousands
        • Voyage of Saint Brendan
        • Power of Art and of Nature
        • Travels of Sir John Mandeville
        • Yazidi Revelation and Black Book
        • Al-Biruni on the Great Flood
        • Voyage of the Zeno Brothers
        • The Kensington Runestone (Hoax)
        • Islamic Discovery of America
        • The Aztec Creation Myth
      • Lost Civilizations >
        • Atlantis >
          • Plato's Atlantis Dialogues >
            • Timaeus
            • Critias
          • Fragments on Atlantis
          • Panchaea: The Other Atlantis
          • Eumalos on Atlantis (Hoax)
          • Gómara on Atlantis
          • Sardinia and Atlantis
          • Santorini and Atlantis
          • The Mound Builders and Atlantis
          • Donnelly's Atlantis
          • Atlantis in Morocco
          • Atlantis and the Sea Peoples
          • W. Scott-Elliot >
            • The Story of Atlantis
            • The Lost Lemuria
          • The Lost Atlantis
          • Atlantis in Africa
          • How I Found Atlantis (Hoax)
          • Termier on Atlantis
          • The Critias and Minoan Crete
          • Rebuttal to Termier
          • Further Responses to Termier
          • Flinders Petrie on Atlantis
        • Lost Cities >
          • Miscellaneous Lost Cities
          • The Seven Cities
          • The Lost City of Paititi
          • Manuscript 512
          • The Idolatrous City of Iximaya (Hoax)
          • The 1885 Moberly Lost City Hoax
          • The Elephants of Paredon (Hoax)
        • OOPARTs
        • Oronteus Finaeus Antarctica Map
        • Caucasians in Panama
        • Jefferson's Excavation
        • Fictitious Discoveries in America
        • Against Diffusionism
        • Tunnels Under Peru
        • The Parahyba Inscription (Hoax)
        • Mound Builders
        • Gunung Padang
        • Tales of Enchanted Islands
        • The 1907 Ancient World Map Hoax
        • The 1909 Grand Canyon Hoax
        • The Interglacial Period
        • Solving Oak Island
      • Religious Conspiracies >
        • Pantera, Father of Jesus?
        • Toledot Yeshu
        • Peter of les Vaux-de-Cernay on Cathars
        • Testimony of Jean de Châlons
        • Rosslyn Chapel and the 'Prentice's Pillar
        • The Many Wives of Jesus
        • Templar Infiltration of Labor
        • Louis Martin & the Holy Bloodline
        • The Life of St. Issa (Hoax)
        • On the Person of Jesus Christ
      • Giants in the Earth >
        • Fossil Origins of Myths >
          • Fossil Teeth and Bones of Elephants
          • Fossil Elephants
          • Fossil Bones of Teutobochus
          • Fossil Mammoths and Giants
          • Giants' Bones Dug Out of the Earth
          • Fossils and the Supernatural
          • Fossils, Myth, and Pseudo-History
          • Man During the Stone Age
          • Fossil Bones and Giants
          • American Elephant Myths
          • The Mammoth and the Flood
          • Fossils and Myth
          • Fossil Origin of the Cyclops
          • Mastodon, Mammoth, and Man
        • Fragments on Giants
        • Manichaean Book of Giants
        • Geoffrey on British Giants
        • Alfonso X's Hermetic History of Giants
        • Boccaccio and the Fossil 'Giant'
        • Book of Howth
        • Purchas His Pilgrimage
        • Edmond Temple's 1827 Giant Investigation
        • The Giants of Sardinia
        • Giants and the Sons of God
        • The Magnetism of Evil
        • Tertiary Giants
        • Smithsonian Giant Reports
        • Early American Giants
        • The Giant of Coahuila
        • Jewish Encyclopedia on Giants
        • Index of Giants
        • Newspaper Accounts of Giants
        • Lanier's A Book of Giants
      • Science and History >
        • Halley on Noah's Comet
        • The Newport Tower
        • Iron: The Stone from Heaven
        • Ararat and the Ark
        • Pyramid Facts and Fancies
        • Argonauts before Homer
        • The Deluge
        • Crown Prince Rudolf on the Pyramids
        • Old Mythology in New Apparel
        • Blavatsky on Dinosaurs
        • Teddy Roosevelt on Bigfoot
        • Devil Worship in France
        • Maspero's Review of Akhbar al-zaman
        • The Holy Grail as Lucifer's Crown Jewel
        • The Mutinous Sea
        • The Rock Wall of Rockwall
        • Fabulous Zoology
        • The Origins of Talos
        • Mexican Mythology
        • Chinese Pyramids
        • Maqrizi's Names of the Pharaohs
      • Extreme History >
        • Roman Empire Hoax
        • American Antiquities
        • American Cataclysms
        • England, the Remnant of Judah
        • Historical Chronology of the Mexicans
        • Maspero on the Predynastic Sphinx
        • Vestiges of the Mayas
        • Ragnarok: The Age of Fire and Gravel
        • Origins of the Egyptian People
        • The Secret Doctrine >
          • Volume 1: Cosmogenesis
          • Volume 2: Anthropogenesis
        • Phoenicians in America
        • The Electric Ark
        • Traces of European Influence
        • Prince Henry Sinclair
        • Pyramid Prophecies
        • Templars of Ancient Mexico
        • Chronology and the "Riddle of the Sphinx"
        • The Faith of Ancient Egypt
        • Spirit of the Hour in Archaeology
        • Book of the Damned
        • Great Pyramid As Noah's Ark
        • Richard Shaver's Proofs
    • Alien Encounters >
      • US Government Ancient Astronaut Files >
        • Fortean Society and Columbus
        • Inquiry into Shaver and Palmer
        • The Skyfort Document
        • Whirling Wheels
        • Denver Ancient Astronaut Lecture
        • Soviet Search for Lemuria
        • Visitors from Outer Space
        • Unidentified Flying Objects (Abstract)
        • "Flying Saucers"? They're a Myth
        • UFO Hypothesis Survival Questions
        • Air Force Academy UFO Textbook
        • The Condon Report on Ancient Astronauts
        • Atlantis Discovery Telegrams
        • Ancient Astronaut Society Telegram
        • Noah's Ark Cables
        • The Von Daniken Letter
        • CIA Psychic Probe of Ancient Mars
        • Scott Wolter Lawsuit
        • UFOs in Ancient China
        • CIA Report on Noah's Ark
        • CIA Noah's Ark Memos
        • Congressional Ancient Aliens Testimony
        • Ancient Astronaut and Nibiru Email
        • Congressional Ancient Mars Hearing
        • House UFO Hearing
      • Ancient Extraterrestrials >
        • Premodern UFO Sightings
        • The Moon Hoax
        • Inhabitants of Other Planets
        • Blavatsky on Ancient Astronauts
        • The Stanzas of Dzyan (Hoax)
        • Aerolites and Religion
        • What Is Theosophy?
        • Plane of Ether
        • The Adepts from Venus
      • A Message from Mars
      • Saucer Mystery Solved?
      • Orville Wright on UFOs
      • Interdimensional Flying Saucers
      • Flying Saucers Are Real
      • Report on UFOs
    • The Supernatural >
      • The Devils of Loudun
      • Sublime and Beautiful
      • Voltaire on Vampires
      • Demonology and Witchcraft
      • Thaumaturgia
      • Bulgarian Vampires
      • Religion and Evolution
      • Transylvanian Superstitions
      • Defining a Zombie
      • Dread of the Supernatural
      • Vampires
      • Werewolves and Vampires and Ghouls
      • Science and Fairy Stories
      • The Cursed Car
    • Classic Fiction >
      • Lucian's True History
      • Some Words with a Mummy
      • The Coming Race
      • King Solomon's Mines
      • An Inhabitant of Carcosa
      • The Xipéhuz
      • Lot No. 249
      • The Novel of the Black Seal
      • The Island of Doctor Moreau
      • Pharaoh's Curse
      • Edison's Conquest of Mars
      • The Lost Continent
      • Count Magnus
      • The Mysterious Stranger
      • The Wendigo
      • Sredni Vashtar
      • The Lost World
      • The Red One
      • H. P. Lovecraft >
        • Dagon
        • The Call of Cthulhu
        • History of the Necronomicon
        • At the Mountains of Madness
        • Lovecraft's Library in 1932
      • The Skeptical Poltergeist
      • The Corpse on the Grating
      • The Second Satellite
      • Queen of the Black Coast
      • A Martian Odyssey
    • Classic Genre Movies
    • Miscellaneous Documents >
      • The Balloon-Hoax
      • A Problem in Greek Ethics
      • The Migration of Symbols
      • The Gospel of Intensity
      • De Profundis
      • The Life and Death of Crown Prince Rudolf
      • The Bathtub Hoax
      • Crown Prince Rudolf's Letters
      • Position of Viking Women
      • Employment of Homosexuals
      • James Dean's Love Letters
      • The Amazing James Dean Hoax!
    • Free Classic Pseudohistory eBooks
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