Regular readers will remember Scott Creighton, who has published a number of poorly researched books about Egyptian history containing various occult and fringe conspiracy theories. I criticized him in a previous review for writing about medieval Arabic-language pyramid myths as an accurate guide to ancient Egyptian practices, and it seems that he didn’t quite take the lesson. Creighton has a new book coming out next year, and his publisher posted an excerpt on Amazon in which he finds a new way to misuse medieval pyramid myths. Get a load of this section in which he alleges that the recently discovered and still unexplored “void” in the Great Pyramid is some sort of “recovery vault” to restore life and knowledge after the Flood—the essence of the medieval myth: This idea of a “Recovery Vault” is not unlike our modern-day seed vault on Svalbaard in the Arctic Circle, which opened in 2008. I did not, however, arrive at this Recovery Vault conclusion of my own accord--I took my cue from what the ancient Egyptian texts tell us: Now this is an interesting mess. I suppose we should start by insisting quite loudly that the passage Creighton quotes is not an ancient Egyptian text. It is a paragraph from the Akhbār al-zamān, a tenth or eleventh century Arabic treatise on the history of Egypt.
Creighton has quoted from the version translated in Col. Richard William Howard Vyse’s Operations from 1837, which is both incomplete and wrongly attributed to the historian al-Mas’udi. In prior publications, Creighton had given al-Mas’udi as the author of the passage and identified it as medieval. Almost three years ago, Creighton had attributed the same text to Mas’udi reporting a Coptic oral tradition that dated back to the Old Kingdom. I criticized him for it, and now the same supposedly Coptic oral story has become both an ancient written text and “ancient Egyptian.” As Abu Ma’shar and the actual al-Mas’udi testified in the ninth and tenth centuries respectively, the story Creighton believes represents an ancient tradition about the Great Pyramid was first applied to the Egyptian temples, particularly the great temple at the alchemical center of Akhmim, and not the pyramids. As Abu Ma’shar explicitly wrote: “Fearing the destruction of knowledge and the disappearance of the arts in the Flood, he [Hermes] built the great temples; one is a veritable mountain called the Temple in Akhmim, in which he carved representations of the arts and instruments, including engraved explanations of science, in order to pass them on to those who would come after him, lest he see them disappear from the world” (Ibn Juljul, Tabaqat al-atibbaʾ 9-10, my trans.). In turn, this traces back to Greco-Roman stories from Late Antiquity that referred to Egyptian temples and tombs in the same terms (e.g. Ammianus Marcellinus, Roman History 22.15.30). There is no record of the stories being applied to the pyramids prior to the late 900s CE. My own book on the subject of pyramid myths and legends comes out in August 2021 from the trade division of Indiana University Press.
92 Comments
Martin Stower
11/23/2020 06:45:46 pm
Progress of the quote.
Reply
Hanslune
11/24/2020 04:35:59 pm
Howdy Martin
Reply
Martin Stower
11/25/2020 09:24:08 am
No reaction so far, but then the post before yours is dated September 19, so not exactly a live discussion.
Martin Stower
11/25/2020 12:17:48 pm
We may, however, it seems, look forward to further excerpts.
It is always telling if somebody repeats an error after he has been clearly informed that it is an error.
Reply
Kent
11/24/2020 09:23:52 am
It speaks less to the media than to your choices as a consumer.
Reply
It is not the first time that such a space is detected, and it is always the same story: They (Egyptian authorities and Egyptologists) talk a lot about being cautious, and in the end they will just drill a hole (which was clear from the beginning, since no other way is possible). The technology is all there and all is said and methods are known, so they just could have done it in these three years.
Jim
11/24/2020 07:37:13 pm
"It is not the first time that such a space is detected, and it is always the same story: They (Egyptian authorities and Egyptologists) talk a lot about being cautious, and in the end they will just drill a hole (which was clear from the beginning, since no other way is possible). The technology is all there and all is said and methods are known, so they just could have done it in these three years."
Kent
11/24/2020 08:37:40 pm
"It is always telling if somebody repeats an error after he has been clearly informed that it is an error."
Kent
11/25/2020 12:36:14 pm
Let's make a wager then. If you outlive me (many have tried) and they drill a hole during your lifetime, you win.
E.P. Grondine
11/25/2020 08:57:45 pm
"The media do not cover such cultural events any more on page one. There is no identification with history any more. It is perceived as a curiosity, as an entertainment, not as a message with a potential meaning. There is no idea that the way we live and think today depends on developments in Egypt thousands of years ago."
Kent
11/26/2020 03:33:45 pm
Here's a hint. When you get your first publisher, then you can offer Jason advice. No one cares about your stuff because science is still not decided on it. You are a bitter old man offering a published author unsolicited advice on how to improve his published books. It's not a good look. People of substance use private channels for that sort of thing, but you are more the "look at me!" sort.
Larry storch
11/28/2020 02:18:50 am
E.P. Grondine, I’m not going to pretend that I typically agree with you, but your viewpoints are certainly thought provoking and unique. Regardless, I think we all recognize who the real “bitter old man” is in this dialogue.
Doc rock
11/28/2020 11:23:24 pm
I dont think that the average person is chomping at the bit to read about a void in a pyramid or are losing sleep over when they will drill into it. The people who want this type of thing done yesterday tend to be conspiracy theorist types who push the narrative that a cabal led by Zahi Hawass are dragging their feet because they dont want the world to know that the precise directions to Hancock's lost civilization or the secrets of the universe are inscribed on the walls.
Jim
11/29/2020 10:18:20 am
Doc, my theory is that when they say they drilled and found sand in a void, that is an elaborate hoax perpetrated by the Smithsonian and academia to hide the fact that it was full of hooked X's, Templar treasure, the remains of many giants along with the entire ninth Roman legion still alive.
Doc rock
11/30/2020 07:12:57 am
Is it really a void or is it actually filled with copper that registers differently in the scan than the surrounding stone. Now we know where all that great lakes copper went. Hell with drilling, let's get after it with jackhammers. The world deserves the truth!
Jim
11/30/2020 10:51:20 am
Maybe Rudy can start a lawsuit to get all the stolen copper back.
Kent
11/30/2020 04:38:46 pm
Maybe Trudeau can with a majority of the vote.
Nat Thur
12/1/2020 06:26:00 pm
If anyone in the Egyptian Department of Antiquities has homeowners insurance i am sure it will cover their defense in the lawsuit.
Jim
12/1/2020 09:25:26 pm
As long as they don't have a lawyer who took a a pre-law major, the Scales of justice may be against you.
Jim
11/24/2020 09:55:58 am
" What does this say about the Egyptian authorities? "
Reply
Kent
11/26/2020 12:57:31 pm
"Not buying that you know better than the pros, It seems a little arrogant to me."
Crash55
11/24/2020 10:47:43 am
I watched a show on the detection of the void. IT may not actually be a void but just an area with very low density - loose rubble fill for example. It is also a ways in from the outside and rather high up for drilling into it is not easy.
Reply
Jim
11/24/2020 03:15:00 pm
Most likely filled with grain.
Crash55
11/24/2020 08:10:36 pm
Jim - highly unlikely. Sounds like something Ben Carson would have claimed
Kent
11/24/2020 09:06:42 pm
What is something filled with something if not a void? The remedial work never ends.
Crash55
11/25/2020 08:11:34 am
Kent, if it is filled with something (other than air) it is not a void. Per Webster’s a void is an empty space.
Jim
11/25/2020 09:52:47 am
Well, perhaps it is where they store their lightbulbs !
Kent
11/25/2020 12:52:41 pm
If you put something into an empty space, is it still empty? Do empty spaces even exist? What makes air so special? Are you in charge of rules? Shall we all report to you now?
Crash55
11/25/2020 04:01:01 pm
Kent, I don't have to worry about being an idiot as you are doing a fine job of it for all of us.
Jim
11/25/2020 04:21:20 pm
"Don't be an idiot."
Crash55
11/25/2020 05:32:15 pm
Jim, sand is a definite possibility. It would present as a lower density than the stone around it. I would not be at all surprised to find rubble with sand filling in the gaps. That would be the fastest way to fill large spaces or to backfill the ramp
Kent
11/25/2020 08:10:59 pm
The idiocy never stops.
Zahi obvious
11/25/2020 11:13:25 pm
"What makes air so special."
Crash55
11/26/2020 03:40:42 pm
Kent you are truly an idiot and a troll. I will put my CV up against yours any day of the week. You pathetic moronic troll.
Jim
11/26/2020 04:08:16 pm
Crash, I take your point, why quarry and drag 2.5 ton blocks of stone when you can simply fill areas not necessary to to structural integrity with cobble and/or sand which would still give lateral support to structurally necessary parts of the pyramid.
Crash55
11/26/2020 06:02:30 pm
And before someone points to a web page showing even load distribution under a pyramid that is sophomore level statics. That requires lots of assumptions including everything being perfectly uniform and joined together. In small structures those assumptions are fine. Not when you get to ones the size of the pyramids though.
Crash55
11/26/2020 08:28:55 pm
Jim, I haven’t read up on where they found the sand nor it’s makeup. Silica is the most common component of inland sand.
Kent
11/26/2020 09:09:58 pm
Remember that your argument began with "you watched a TV show."
Crash55
11/27/2020 12:40:42 pm
Kent, I know I said I wouldn't respond again but your stupidity is beyond belief either that or you are close to being a professional troll.
Jim
11/27/2020 12:51:36 pm
Crash: I can't claim to be very knowledgeable about this, perhaps watch the video I linked to.
Man who says nee
11/27/2020 02:24:41 pm
Kent thinks that the Kensington Stone is an enclosed space and thus is an arch. His logic reminds me of the witch trial in Monty Python's Search for the Holy Grail.
Kent
11/27/2020 05:42:53 pm
"Jim was able to grasp what I was trying to say." As bar setting goes that's borderline child abuse but let's take a step back and realize I'm trying to talk to a (longwinded) "academic and researcher" who thinks a pile of rocks and an arch are the same thing. Can we stay focused on the fact that you don't understand the difference between a pyramid (pile of rocks) and an arch?
Crash55
11/28/2020 10:16:18 am
Kent, again you show vastly subpar reading comprehension skills. I said I was a researcher. I never said I was an academic. I said that CVs are used to judge skill level in the research / academic world.
Crash55
11/28/2020 10:38:42 am
Jim.,
Pink House
11/28/2020 09:09:10 pm
Crash55,
Jim
11/29/2020 12:04:16 am
Ya, my point was that there was indeed "voids" found that were not technically voids, as you surmised.
Crash55
11/29/2020 10:36:45 am
Pink House, I never said he was a good troll. Though he does often elicit an emotional response from me
Crash55
11/24/2020 10:03:42 am
Has anyone ever found any actual ancient Egyptian texts with similar stories? I watch a lot of shows that cover Egyptian archaeology and have never seen anything similar.
Reply
Rock Knocker
11/24/2020 10:29:10 am
What does it say...?
Reply
Hanslune
11/24/2020 04:44:29 pm
Yes it can take quite some time to arrange for a western donor to pay for the research/drilling and also how to select who will benefit from it. Additionally, they have to agree whose nephews will be hired to assist the investigation and most importantly who will be blamed if something goes wrong.
Reply
E.P. Grondine
11/25/2020 08:45:40 pm
Hi Hanslune-
Hanslune
11/26/2020 05:24:02 pm
Pick on them? LOL
Kent
11/26/2020 06:02:23 pm
"Jason's book did not have an image of the precursor of the Grave Creek stone, for example."
Martin Stower
11/24/2020 05:17:36 pm
Creighton first gave the quote an outing here:
Reply
The Rooster
11/25/2020 02:27:13 pm
Totally off topic.
Reply
Kent
11/25/2020 04:12:09 pm
You're asking if a bent piece of metal is useful. I've never known such to be the case. That's just insane. How could it possibly be useful? If a Coca-Cola bottle falls out of the sky you could perhaps use it to smash the Coca-Cola bottle. Don't tell me it's not useful!
Reply
The Rooster
11/25/2020 07:02:36 pm
That's a really good question! About the bottle.
The Rooster
11/25/2020 07:17:04 pm
"If a Coca-Cola bottle falls out of the sky you could perhaps use it to smash the Coca-Cola bottle."
The Rooster
11/26/2020 03:12:37 am
Also?
E.P. Grondine
11/25/2020 08:40:47 pm
Hi Jason-
Reply
Kent
11/26/2020 04:19:24 pm
One of your neighbors could fail to clean up after their dog and you would think it's asteroid or comet related. Sad.
Reply
I have seen that Jason's Pyramids book is fully announced on the editor's page, complete with PDF flyer and everything ..... but announced only for August 2021.
Reply
Kent
11/27/2020 12:50:18 am
I'm guessing the answer will be "We don't work for you, piss off."
Reply
Martin Stower
11/26/2020 07:05:37 pm
Is Void the HOAX II we were promised?
Reply
Nerd11135
11/27/2020 07:36:20 am
Weird, and somewhat depressing, to see Mr. Colavito's site still being used as troll gladiator training.
Reply
Hanslune
11/27/2020 12:55:53 pm
Yep that is why I rarely post here. I greatly enjoy JC's blogs, books and comments but his decision to let the heirs of the troll 'American Negro' and his ilk destroy the comments section on a regular basis seems both odd and off putting.
Reply
Winnie texas prom queen
11/27/2020 04:12:17 pm
But fewer trolls and with some semblance of a moderating filter to keep the idiocy to a reasonably low level compared to the past.
Reply
The Rooster
11/28/2020 01:07:14 am
Oh? Uh, uh.
The Rooster
11/27/2020 05:28:29 pm
Holy Christ, what a tedious post!
Reply
Crash55
11/28/2020 07:05:54 pm
The voids being the remnants of an internal ramp system is one of the possibilities identified by the team. I mentioned that in one of my posts
Reply
The Rooster
11/29/2020 02:03:39 am
Truly lovely to be in agreement with you.
Martin Stower
11/27/2020 05:54:13 pm
This is a cogent comment on the imaginary basis of Creighton’s assertions:
Reply
Jim
11/27/2020 11:27:06 pm
He reminds me of the black knight in Monty Python.
Reply
The Rooster
11/28/2020 05:41:36 pm
Can't believe this ATS craziness has landed here.
Reply
Crash55
11/28/2020 07:12:18 pm
You are viewing an ancient society through a lens of today’s society. The ancient Egyptians viewed things differently.
Reply
The Roosters
11/28/2020 08:25:22 pm
I wouldn't, if I were you, necessarily judge my historical "speculum". 11/29/2020 03:43:30 pm
Whenever the subject of the pyramids comes up I cannot but harken back to my first reading of Sir Thomas Browne's famous judgements "But to subsist in bones, and be but Pyramidally extant, is a fallacy in duration" and "Man is a noble animal, splendid in ashes, and pompous in the grave."
Reply
Hanslune
11/29/2020 05:17:44 pm
Yes a colossus waste of effort and resources - nothing is impossible or wasteful if ordered done by a person who thinks he is a god.
Reply
11/30/2020 12:33:12 pm
Thanks, but I was referring to the pyramids specifically. I have nothing against the more modest mastabas and other tombs. Even today every modern cemetery has over elaborate and expensive funerary monuments. But the pyramids, and many temples like Baalbek, are just off the charts in terms of manpower that could have been spent on decent housing for the general populace and lowered taxes. The idea the pyramids were a work project ignores there could have been improvements made on so many other useful fronts with less effort.
Kent
11/30/2020 05:33:28 pm
It could be argued that a society that thought this sort of thing was a good idea had to be borderline retarded. Certainly not people I would trust with children, fire, or sharp objects. To sum up:
Crash55
11/29/2020 08:08:41 pm
I would argue that it was not a totally negative result. It kept the people busy during the off season (latest theory is they built the pyramid while not farming). One of the goals was to be remembered and we still talk about the pharaohs that built them so they were successful in that way. I am also betting the ancient Egyptians were quite proud of their monuments so that would be a positive as well.
Reply
Martin Stower
12/6/2020 06:29:12 pm
On Creighton’s “recovery vault” tomfoolery, consider this:
Reply
Jim
12/6/2020 10:18:18 pm
I couldn't get past his alignment drawing where he draws the (G2) pyramid in the wrong position so as to fit his alignment and then blames the ancient Egyptian for building it in the wrong position.
Reply
Martin Stower
12/7/2020 08:02:32 pm
Faulting reality for not being what he says it should be is characteristic of his “method”.
Martin Stower
12/6/2020 07:32:53 pm
“I took my cue from . . .”
Reply
Martin Stower
12/6/2020 09:52:00 pm
Last of those should be this:
Reply
Martin Stower
12/7/2020 11:34:46 am
A fuller statement:
Reply
Martin Stower
6/20/2021 01:45:43 pm
URL for the fuller statement is now this:
Reply
Martin Stower
6/7/2021 05:51:04 pm
This appears to be new (but I am not sure how new):
Reply
Another interesting study of these Prisca Theologica traditions (besides Jason's book of course) is 'The Lost Pillars of Enoch' by Tobias Churton. He covers much the same ground of dubious Arabic scholarship and confusion of periods and personalities.
Reply
Your comment will be posted after it is approved.
Leave a Reply. |
AuthorI am an author and researcher focusing on pop culture, science, and history. Bylines: New Republic, Esquire, Slate, etc. There's more about me in the About Jason tab. Newsletters
Enter your email below to subscribe to my newsletter for updates on my latest projects, blog posts, and activities, and subscribe to Culture & Curiosities, my Substack newsletter.
Categories
All
Terms & ConditionsPlease read all applicable terms and conditions before posting a comment on this blog. Posting a comment constitutes your agreement to abide by the terms and conditions linked herein.
Archives
February 2025
|