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The Astonishing Racial Claims of Erich von Daniken

1/23/2014

87 Comments

 
Television is apparently a medium where consistency doesn’t matter, and as long as you’ve been on some show somewhere you can always find a new program higher up the dial. Ancient Aliens pundit Mike Bara, author of Ancient Aliens on Mars and Ancient Aliens on the Moon, has a new show from production company Raw TV, Uncovering Aliens, airing on various Discovery networks (Animal Planet and Science Channel), where he is the skeptic, casting cold water on recent American UFO claims. I can’t wrap my mind around it.

While I try to digest the bizarre sight of Bara endorsing UFO claims on Ancient Aliens on Friday nights while debunking them on Uncovering Aliens on Wednesdays, I thought I’d talk a bit today about some surprising and disturbing information posted last week over on the Bad Archaeology blog. Keith Fitzpatrick-Matthews asks “Is Pseudoarchaeology Racist?” In addition to presenting the very clear evidence from the case of Great Zimbabwe, he also presents some telling excerpts from one of Erich von Däniken’s lesser works, Signs of the Gods (1979; English trans. 1980).

I read Signs about twenty years ago, but I admit that I haven’t returned to it as frequently as von Däniken’s other books because it lacks an index, making it hard to look things up. It turns out I should have reviewed this one more carefully because it contains some of von Däniken’s most appalling race-based claims. Here’s a sample from those passages found by Fitzpatrick-Matthews:

“The evolutionists say that man descends from monkeys. Yet who has ever seen a white monkey? Or a dark ape with curly hair such as the black race has?”

 “Were the extraterrestrials able to opt between different races from the beginning? Did they endow different human groups with different abilities to survive in different climatic and geographical conditions?”

”Today it is assumed that primitive men had dark skins.”

“Was the black race a failure and did the extraterrestrials change the genetic code by gene surgery and then programme a white or a yellow race?”

“Nearly all negroes are musical: they have rhythm in their blood.”

“I quite understand that I am playing with dynamite if I ask whether the extraterrestrials ‘allotted’ specific tasks to the basic races from the very beginning, i.e. programmed them with special abilities.”

“I am not a racialist… Yet my thirst for knowledge enables me to ignore the taboo on asking racial questions simply because it is untimely and dangerous… why are we like we are?

“Once this basic question is accepted, we cannot and should not avoid the explosive sequel: is there a chosen race?”

Von Däniken asserts that if evolution were true, then the “black” or “Negroid” race was the first to evolve. Because black people did not “spread out” all over the earth, they therefore did not evolve. Instead, the aliens placed different colored people across the world for “educative effect,” to prove that no matter our skin color we are all the same species.

I’d like to add to Fitzpatrick-Matthews’s list the following paragraph, which is, I think, even worse, both for being racist and for completely lacking any understanding of the subject (evolution) he claims to discuss:

A black family emigrates from its home in the tropical zone of the earth and settles in a cooler region. Pigments change down the generations, dark skins become light, perhaps so light, the negroids become white. Dark skin, say the racial specialists, no longer being necessary as a protection against the sun. OK, but in his new environment the black man would also have to lose his curly hair, his prominent dark eyes and protruding lips, otherwise he could never become a white man. But it’s all quite simple, someone will tell me. The black breeds with a white and there you are...

He then claims that African people take their traits from “the apes,” which I presume implies that white people are somehow genetically distinct from the apes and the Africans. Von Däniken further claims that “intermediate” races such as the Eskimo and the Arabs were produced by “racial interbreeding.” He therefore complains that science asserts on the one hand that there was originally only a black race but that somehow the white race emerged from it. Being opposed to evolution and not understanding it (mutation seems beyond him), he asserts that like can only produce like, so that there being “neither a white nor a half-breed” for black people to mate with, it was impossible for black people to produce white offspring.

Fortunately, von Däniken exempts himself from charges of racism by acknowledging that such questions can spark cries of racism but that he is being brave in refusing to sweep under the carpet uncomfortable questions. However, he says that “understanding” what goes on “in the heads and ‘hearts’ of members of another race” is “so difficult.” He explains that Europeans cannot fathom why black people attend funerals with “tomtoms,” thus conflating (purposely) cultural and biological variation, and he says he is deeply interested to learn whether there are “races which are obviously endowed with higher intelligence than others.” The use of “obviously” suggests that he has an answer to that question, despite his next sentence asserting that he does not ascribe to racist theories. He follows this by reflecting that the Jews are the Chosen People, but since Judaism isn’t a race, the chosen race must therefore be the one to which the Jews belong: “the European race.” The “outstanding achievements of Jewish scientists,” von Däniken wrote, are the result not of Judaism but their membership in the European race.

Von Däniken asserts that the “extraterrestrials did choose a specific race.” He won’t say what that race is, but he leans heavily on Jewish claims to be the chosen people, which we have just seen him connect to the white (European) race. There can only be one conclusion, even if unstated. He then advocates eugenics, suggesting that modern genetic research will advise which combinations of races “are beneficial and which should be eliminated.” He seriously asks whether the aliens want “strict segregation” of the races, and he advocates human cloning to perpetuate the very best superior specimens in the event of disaster.

We know from documents I obtained from the National Archives that in these years von Däniken secretly tried to influence the U.S. Republican Party to use his alien theories to energize voters to support conservative politics, particularly in opposing creeping socialism. We also know from his recent books that he remains uncomfortable with changing gender norms, writing as he did in 2009’s Twilight of the Gods that if Islamic prophecy were correct the world would have already ended because “women act like men and the men act like women.”

Also in that 2009 book, Erich von Däniken decried efforts to link him to racism: “And suddenly Erich von Däniken is associated with idiotic racists, as if the ‘heavenly seed’ were my idea and I had made up the ‘chosen ones’ myself.” Well, I think that the racism claim has a bit more to it than that.

And remember, folks: Cable TV gives a frequent platform to a man who openly wondered if the black race were a failure and whether white people are the aliens’ chosen master race.

87 Comments
Ken R. Stone
1/23/2014 03:01:34 am

What kind of "Racism" is this?
It should be defined as gooky racism and be distinguished from mainstream political racism.
Sceptics should classify things better than they do,

Reply
RLewis
1/23/2014 03:10:29 am

Do you think mainstream political racist would disagree with EVD's comments (other than questioning the alien interaction)?

Reply
Ken R. Stone
1/23/2014 03:21:29 am

Please define which mainstream politics you are referring to

RLewis
1/23/2014 03:23:59 am

The ones you noted in your post.

Ken R. Stone
1/23/2014 03:35:32 am

Of course, when Scott Wolter and Erich Von Daniken deny that they are racists they are 100 per cent correct, because they are indeed not racists, and their offbeat theories represent something entirely different

RLewis
1/23/2014 03:40:07 am

First, I don't equate Scott Wolter with EVD. I don't think SW is a racist. I do think EVD's comments noted above are racist.

Ken R. Stone
1/23/2014 03:43:22 am

Except that EvD is not denigrating anyone on the basis of ethnic origin, he is merely expressing his quack ancient astronaut theories and nothing else. He himself is not engaging in what can be called mainstream racism

Jason Colavito link
1/23/2014 03:47:46 am

I think, Ken, you're making a distinction between policies of discrimination and advocacy of race-based essentialism. The first definition of racism in the dictionary is: "the belief that all members of each race possess characteristics or abilities specific to that race, esp. so as to distinguish it as inferior or superior to another race or races." EvD's 1979 comments meet all of those criteria.

RLewis
1/23/2014 03:49:51 am

I consider statements like "Was the black race a failure..."
and "[which combinations of races] are beneficial and which should be eliminated" as racist remarks.

Scott Hamilton
1/23/2014 03:52:24 am

Also, Ken, I find it quite curious that you don't even seem to acknowledge the possibility that EVD's racism is what let him to those particular Ancient Astronaut theories, as opposed to the other way around.

Tjohnson
1/16/2020 09:07:12 pm

As a black man that has a very strong interest in ET's, etc. I knew that the topic of race would pop it's head and certain people (some of the white scientists, EVD and other) would claim the 'white race' is the chosen race. Hence, further adding to the current racial issues prevelent from yesteryear and today, that some race would claim that they are the chosen ones. SMH

An Over-Educated Grunt
1/23/2014 03:56:07 am

How exactly, other than enforcement power, are von Däniken's remarks substantially different from Roger Taney's in "Dred Scott?"

Reply
J.A Dickey
1/23/2014 04:46:06 am

Good point. if POTUS Andrew Johnson's racism in the 1800s
is equadistant between CHIEF JUSTICE TANEY's horrid caste
system bias in DRED SCOTT and Barack Obama's urbane
multiculturalism, to be fair to A.J i must opine on FDR, HST
and Virginia's very progressive & erudite WOODROW WILSON!

PaulN. link
3/14/2014 09:57:35 am

The difference is that Chief Justice Roger Taney was writing the up the majority opinion on the Dred Scott decision. An opinion based on the Constitutional readings of the day, and in many ways no worse than some of the decisions that have been handed down since. It is a product of its time for good or ill. EVD on the other hand is like trying to nail jelly to the wall, it only sticks when it wants to. It also allows him plausible deniability, as he constantly changes his mind, but can never remember doing so.

Gunn
1/23/2014 05:10:52 am

Sorry, Ken, I can't resist. I know you meant "goofy" or "kooky" racism, right? Otherwise, "gooky" could be construed as something either W or else McCain would've said. Bite my tongue.

Reply
J.A.D
1/23/2014 05:50:03 am

i am way too young to remember the Korean Police Action that
the U.N had agreed to, but i can remember when Viet-nam
ceased to be hyphenated in print shortly before our veterans
became " Nam vets" as we see LBJ escalate after the 98/2
near total Senate passage of 1964's Tonkin Gulf Resolution
in tandem with its popularity in the House of Representatives.
Regrettably, the word "gook" dates to the 1940s but it did get
on film soundtracks as the Hays Office Code ceased to be!

J.A.D
1/23/2014 06:04:07 am

CORRECTION --- in 1951's THE STEEL HELMET it is said
and Wiki tends to follow it back to prior to and/or during the
Spanish-American War. John McCain is generation typical, he
is rather reserved in his utterances all told, he was a P.O.W
and clearly detested his guards and tormentors, i cut him
some slack on this, but the "W" is in his own rarefied zone
that is such a contrast to the way Gentleman Mitt thinks of
and about the people and places on our vast & wise planet.

J
3/5/2017 06:36:46 pm

Gobbledygook

Xp8268hwb
2/14/2014 04:24:13 am

The same way that dog breeds has physical and intellectual differences, why humans are different? Let's compare for example, a Chinese man who is down and weak with an Italian who has a lot of testosterone and that is high, who do you think is stronger physically? It is obvious that the Italian would be stronger! If we compared the intellectual matter, the Italian would be even smarter than a Chinese because of head format (which defines the size of the brain). This all reflected when the Mongols were defeated by the Romans when trying to invade Europe.
Now observe the Germans...Germans are the best creators in the world.


That was just an example...
i'm learning english because is not my mother language, so sorry.

Reply
Dora
4/21/2015 09:55:37 pm

Are you joking? If you are serious, this is very serious racism and very ignorant. And the Chinese had older and much more refined culture than the Romans.The size of the head doesn't matter, the fold on the brain do, and number of neurons etc.

The question of races of dogs and humans is old racist saying from XIX c. Week logic.

Kim
8/12/2017 04:18:26 am

I think that during the times of this type of thinking, it was a try to not push the buttons, ya know? Im a southern woman,an I can tell you its still tabu.

Reply
Msaint
10/29/2017 08:19:56 pm

Mr. D. conveniently forgot to mention that when you shave a monkey or an ape its skin is always white. I know. At Los Angeles' Griffith Park Zoo where I once worked, when the vets had to perform surgery on an occasional ape or monkey, they shaved the area first. They always had white skin underneath the hair.

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Artie
3/26/2022 11:12:45 pm

True also let's look at how hairy the races are. If you believe man descended from apes look at racial hair, Whites, Black, Native Americans and Asians in that order of hairiness.

Why can't Extraterrestrials have deposited different races from their different space cultures?

Ken R. Stone
1/23/2014 03:53:39 am

"advocacy of race-based essentialism" within the framework of ancient astronaut theorising, which is quack philosophy, should be distinguished from racism based upon discrimination within context of politics (something that belongs to the world of reality)

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Ken R. Stone
1/23/2014 03:55:49 am

"acknowledge the possibility that EVD's racism"

EVD is not a racist, he's a quack ancient astronaut theorist who has nothing against black people or Jews

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An Over-Educated Grunt
1/23/2014 04:05:58 am

The Final Solution was the product of Germann fringe thinking, as I doubt most Germans were aware that Lanz von Liebenfels or Alfred Rosenberg existed in 1932, but starting in 2 33 their acolytes suddenly had a hand in policy decisions. Saying it isn't political or reality-based ignores the fact that every political movement has a philosophical underpinning. Alexander had Aristotle; Alcibiades had Socrates; Stalin had Marx. The philosopher can be as mainstream (Aristotle, Marx) or obscure (Socrates at the time, Liebenfels) as you like, but obscurity is no barrier to being used to further someone's agenda.

RLewis
1/23/2014 04:25:19 am

So, I don't think you're denying that these are racist remarks (are you?). But the question seems to be that if someone makes racist remarks but doesn't INTEND them to be racist or doesn't KNOW they are perceived as racist - are they, themselves, still a racist? I say yes.

J.A. Dickey
1/23/2014 04:56:02 am

Paula Dean's remarks said some thirty years ago are milder
than these "ideas" EVD actually put into print, and i am putting
this inside the context of many of the casual remarks made to
yesteryea'rs FREEDOM RIDERs of the 1960s (whether voting
Democrat or Republican) and not the extremely nasty threats
they had faced as they sought to end Segregation in our nation.


















m

J.A. Dickey
1/23/2014 05:12:45 am

EVD is Swiss and was born in 1935, he is ten years of age
as WWII ends in 1945 so the people around him may not
have been as virulently racist as were the households of
the members of prominent members of the Nazi Party, and
all thru the war we know that Switzerland did its d@mndest
to be as neutral as possible, the backdrop of this is why he
let these words become ink on a page. Some people later on
at its 10 year mark joined the Nazi Party in order to experience
all caste system perks or like young Wernher Von Braun, they
were very good at building rockets & had a skill set the system
liked, wanted + needed. We must define our terms i do feel...

J.A.D
1/23/2014 05:20:53 am

"the members of prominent members of the Nazi Party" (typo)

the extended kin of prominent members of the Nazi Party (this)

The Other J.
1/23/2014 08:26:09 am

So explain the dividing line between EvD's race-based essentialism and his using his trying to "influence the U.S. Republican Party to use his alien theories to energize voters to support conservative politics, particularly in opposing creeping socialism."

If his alien theories include race-based essentialism, and he tried to use those alien theories to influence U.S. politics, it would seem he's smuggling in race-based essentialism to influence politics.

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The Other J.
1/23/2014 08:27:45 am

(Does the Weebly platform offer a comment-edit feature? I always spot my typos after I submit a comment.)

Jason Colavito link
1/23/2014 08:46:33 am

Sadly, no. It's pretty primitive. I'll bring it up with them for a future update.

An Over-Educated Grunt
1/23/2014 04:07:57 am

One day I will learn not to post from my phone. I blame all tips on the combination of not being able to see everything I type and a keyboard that can't read my mind.

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tacitus
1/23/2014 05:59:46 am

I don't care for nor have I been following Van Daniken in many years and I certainly read "Signs of the Gods" at the time. It should be pointed out that Signs is probably racist from a "40 year on" point of view but back then those views were widespread in Western culture. For example I remember hearing about the mysterious certainly non-native-American mound builder culture which was undoubtably wiped out by the the native Americans in school. Also people and peoples views do change in 40 years. So Van Daniken is allowed to change just like the rest of us and he just might be a bit more skeptical as well. And IF he wrote signs today it might well be wrong but not rascist.

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Tara Jordan link
1/23/2014 06:09:12 am

"I realized that North Americans were not interested in being educated. They want to be entertained. The book (UFOs: Nazi Secret Weapon)? was for fun. With a picture of the Führer on the cover and flying saucers coming out of Antarctica it was a chance to get on radio and TV talk shows. For about 15 minutes of an hour program I'd talk about that esoteric stuff....."
Ernst Zündel

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j.a.d
1/23/2014 06:26:13 am

"A black family emigrates from its home in the tropical zone of the earth and settles in a cooler region. Pigments change down the generations, dark skins become light, perhaps so light, the negroids become white. Dark skin, say the racial specialists, no longer being necessary as a protection against the sun. OK, but in his new environment the black man would also have to lose his curly hair, his prominent dark eyes and protruding lips, otherwise he could never become a white man. But it’s all quite simple, someone will tell me. The black breeds with a white and there you are..." EVD

Jason is apt. Here is my question!

TITAN = Early Modern Human & Neanderthal cross
OLYMPIAN GOD OR GODDESS = Actualized Neanderthal
CROMAGNON = EMH = Recent African Immigrant

In the context of OTZI's Alpine much later on Neanderthal DNA
if we try to explain why Neanderthal traits are being dropped
during each aon after the arrival of the Neolithic Revolution in
Europe as we think of Jared Diamond's Guns, Germs + Steel,
If nearly all Neanderthals were brighter than us due to a larger
cranium, are we into a gracile evolutionary downward spiral?
is poor EVD in hippie lingo B@$SackWards in the way he sees
us as a species? The Human Genome project looks beyond
race as a concept in2 all actual workings of our 4 amino acids!

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Gregor
1/23/2014 06:26:27 am

Believe it or not, I was actually going to write you and tell you of Mike Bara's new and interesting endeavours, but I couldn't convince myself it'd be worth your time (being neither ancient nor interesting). Not only is Mike Bara introduced as 'the skeptic', but he comes at the claims and evidence from the other three "investigators" with the same kind of "Are you even serious?" condescension that Ancient Aliens uses to make their straw man arguments. The most telling (and saddest) thing, I think, is that while Mike Bara is introduced as an author in AA, for Uncovering Aliens he's presented as "an experienced aeronautical engineer". Reminds me of the heady, bullshit-laden days of MonsterQuest wherein a Primatologist was introduced as the same...and "anthropologist", and "evolution expert", and "tracker" depending on the episode you watch...or the S.C.U.B.A. diver who suddenly became a marine biologist, tracker, or "animal expert" (when suddenly there was no water to wade in). I realize that certain fields and specializations contain many potential descriptors...but intentionally changing the "I'm a __________" intro, and to do so every episode, strikes me as intentionally dishonest.

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Tara Jordan link
1/23/2014 06:42:51 am

Can we avoid talking about Mike Bara?,I already took a shower 15 minutes ago.

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DAN D
1/23/2014 06:58:30 am

Wow! Talk about a scathing bio on Rational Wiki.

http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Mike_Bara

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Dave Lewis
1/23/2014 02:52:17 pm

I read the rationalwiki on Mike Bara. In his defense, I like what he said about Obama,

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j.a.d
1/23/2014 07:05:19 am

i agree...
was trying to
figure out who
he is. turns
out, he is
((((drumrolls))))
a co-author to
RICHARD C. HOAGLAND

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J.A.D
1/23/2014 07:15:48 am

"Nothing illustrates Bara's abject ignorance of technical matters better than the case of Explorer 1, the very first American satellite (launched 31 Jan 1958).

The brainchild of Wernher Von Braun, Explorer 1 was the success the nation craved after several failed attempts to match the Soviet achievement of Sputnik 1. Because of the imprecision of the rocket fuels of the 50s, and the fact that the Juno rocket had no guidance after first-stage burnout, the orbit parameters were not exactly as planned.

It went into a 223 x 1592 mi orbit, cf. the planned 220 x 1000 mi. Given that the Earth's diameter is 7922 mi, that makes its semi-major axis 4868 mi, cf. the planned 4571, an excess of 6.5%.

Mike Bara, unschooled in orbital mechanics and having no flair for mathematics, totally botched this story. He compared the apogee as measured from the Earth's surface with the planned apogee and quite incorrectly deduced that the rocket had 60% excess power.

In Ch. 12 of The Choice, he wrote:
I won't bore you with the details, but the fact is a miscalculation of that type simply cannot happen. (The Choice, p.144)
He should, perhaps, have bored himself with a little research on the topic.

As he did not, he utterly embarrassed himself by writing an entire chapter about some imaginary "anti-gravity effect" on the basis of a fundamental error."

rationalwiki.org/wiki/Mike_Bara

[Sir Isaac Newton would NOT have made THAT mistake!]

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Will
1/23/2014 07:36:54 am

To subscribe

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The Other J.
1/23/2014 08:37:18 am

What the hell -- spam?

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Jason Colavito link
1/23/2014 08:45:48 am

I think he wants to be notified of new comments without actually commenting.

The Other J.
1/23/2014 08:42:05 am

For what it's worth, here's a trick people can use if they have a book lacking an index and want a way to search it quickly (Jason probably already knows this):

If you have a scanner (and some time), you can scan the book as a pdf. Just use software that will recognize text. Most libraries have this, and some software will even create an index for you.

But even without and index, you can then easily search for terms in the pdf document itself, and again depending on the software, even bookmark and highlight words/groups of words/pages.

Just don't go passing that pdf around unless it's already in public domain.

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Steve
1/23/2014 10:33:16 am

The Other J., your video is waiting in the comments at the other blog post entitled, "Roberto Rodriguez and the Maps of "Aztec" America"

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The Other J.
1/23/2014 11:14:34 am

What video? I thought we were done. And given your track record, why should I trust a video you produced?

The Other J.
1/23/2014 11:33:08 am

Well that was a waste of time. Here's your rhetorical games at play: I said having "america unearthed fake" popping up as the first Google autocomplete suggestion for "america unearthed" should be concerning. You said I'm wrong because it actually only pops up second if you instead only type "america un," as if that makes a difference.

But you wrote seven excessively long responses trying to shift the focus to Google Adwords, and never addressed the point.

That's why we're done. You don't argue in good faith, you just change the subject.

Go talk about metaphors with Gunn or something.

Steve
1/23/2014 11:57:52 am

Put your tail between your legs and go home, "The Other J."
You're busted.

You demanded a screen grab, "Let's try something: You or anyone else reading this, go to Google and type in "america unearthed" and post a link to a screenshot showing what the top suggested autocomplete is. Let's see how unique my situation is. Don't just type it -- show the evidence; screenshots or don't bother. "

I hereby provide you with a 7-1/2 minute screen capture video.

http://youtu.be/IAwlnH9WSYw

You wrote, "You still haven't explained why "america unearthed fake" is showing up first autocomplete suggestions if people are so completely certain of what they are looking for that they ignore the suggestion. If that were the case, the suggestion wouldn't be there."

Wrong on 2 counts. It is NOT the first suggestion, as the video shows. And also, you said, "If that were the case, the suggestion wouldn't be there."

That, dear "The Other J.", is why I showed the other stats from Google Keyword Planner. It shows actual search demand by phrase. As I pointed out to you, "America Unearthed" got 12.100 in the past 30 days and "America Unearthed Fake" got 1,000. The "fake" phrase got fewer searches which is why it is in position 2.

You wrote, "And "america unearthed fake" is the first suggested autocomplete, not the second. If you want to play rhetorical games, at least get your facts straight and look at the screengrab I posted."

See the video and keep your rhetorical games accusation over there.

That link again - http://youtu.be/IAwlnH9WSYw

Then you wrote, "If you're typing "america un" first, then you're doing something different than what I did, which is dishonest."

Dishonest? No. I'm just not being ignorant of how this all works. See the video below and get back to me.

You wrote, "So you agree that they'd be typing in "america unearthed." But that's not what you typed; "america un" could be "america undercover" or "america university." Don't be cute; you're not winning an argument by saying "it's second, not first, nya you lose" when you're not even dealing with the same terms, and you know it."

Thanks for having an opinion that is not based in fact. The facts are in the video at the link below. Keep your "cute," your "nya you lose" and your "Handwavium sophistry. Fail" slams over there. See the video at the link below and get back to me in some way that can

Until you present that apologetic, I'll be over here knowing I'm completely right and you are squirming.

The link, again - http://youtu.be/IAwlnH9WSYw

Steve
1/23/2014 12:05:34 pm

The Other J Squirmer wrote, "You said I'm wrong because it actually only pops up second if you instead only type "america un," as if that makes a difference."

Lie. I said you are wrong because only 1,000 searches for "America Unearthed Fake" versus 12,100 for "America Unearthed" are proof that the searches being completed, meaning clicked, are proof that they know know they want AND that AU producers should NOT be concerned as you suggested.

But this is the absolute best part. The fact that you're such a sore loser.

You proved it by writing, "Yeah, your highness, I guess you've argued me into believing that when you type "america unearthed" into Google, the first suggested autocomplete FOR "AMERICA UNEARTHED" isn't in fact "america unearthed fake." Even though it damn well does. "

Don't try to minimize what I wrote, Other J.

AU and Wolter have only an 8.2% reason to be concerned. They have a 91.8% reason to join me in doing a victory dance over here, squirmy.

Tara Jordan link
1/23/2014 12:21:19 pm

Steve "Baby Face" St Clair strikes again....

Gunn
1/23/2014 12:36:12 pm

Hey, Baby Face Nelson was a tough dude.

The Other J., you are double-busted. Does this mean yer gut exploded twice? No, this is something like a metaphor. Keep me out of your struggles with Steve, unless you desire a double-dose of reality? Is this a metaphor...a threat....a vision? What?

I dunno. Anyway, I'm glad Phil also assists in keeping you in line. It can't hurt. You like to argue too much. You spend a lot of time stirring up nonsense over split-hair issues. You end up wasting not only your own time, the time of others.

Jason Colavito link
1/23/2014 12:38:57 pm

For people who complain about ad hominem attacks, this is degenerating into personal attacks that we could do without. Additionally, since this has nothing to do with Erich von Daniken I would prefer we stay on topic. This blog post had nothing to do with America Unearthed.

Tara Jordan
1/23/2014 01:08:56 pm

Jason,with all due respect,something has to be done with this imbecile.St Clair is a public nuisance,get rid of him.
If you don't have the ability to get his IP & block him,I can tell you how
to do it.

Steve
1/23/2014 01:28:32 pm

You are quite right, Jason. Sorry, everyone, for the interruption.

We now return you to your regularly scheduled blog post and comments in which some poor new target is assessed as a racist.

Will
1/23/2014 01:47:48 pm

So, just to clarify...

The other J stated that when a person begins typing america unearthed in Google search that one of the first autocomplete suggestions adds fake.

Then Steve actually recorded and produced a YouTube video to prove him wrong?

That is pretty hardcore to be right about such a small thing.

Only Me
1/23/2014 02:03:17 pm

Come on, Steve! Eric von Daniken is anything BUT a "poor target". The man has said repeatedly that humanity is the result of alien tinkering with the DNA of primitive primates millions of years ago. I would think someone with your focus in genetic studies would be the first to step up and shout, "Bullshit!"

He attributes every event in human history-from evolution to religion-to "alien ancestors". Why is it suddenly beyond the pale to believe he would have racist inclinations? There's the slimmest chance he's changed his attitude, but he was diagnosed by a psychiatrist as being a habitual liar.

From going to prison for bilking funds to finance his globetrotting adventures, in order to "see" alien influence everywhere he went, to trying to claim this hogwash as "intellectual property", his track record demonstrates a man who is willing to do or say anything to make a buck off the snake oil he peddles.

Please read the excerpts from his book again, and then tell me he's still a "poor target".

Tara Jordan
1/23/2014 02:08:04 pm

This is not true.Steve St Clair gets "america unearthed fake" results because he has already been searching for it.
Flush your DNS cache,delete all cookies & internet history, reboot your computer & you `ll get a "fresh" Google search results

Gunn
1/23/2014 02:51:24 pm

Jason, you have a habit of butting-in to make a general point, but right after I post. My comments have been mild compared to others here, yet you chose to butt-in, again, again, after my comments. You have done this several times. Why don't you spread your joy around a bit more, a bit less selectively.

Gunn
1/23/2014 02:55:10 pm

Not to mention this topic would be suitable for a pigeon-hole by now.

Gunn
1/23/2014 02:58:09 pm

Will, it's called splitting fine hairs. It's a tactic to annoy. I was a victim of this, too, over "metaphor" of all things!

Shane Sullivan
1/23/2014 10:45:50 am

I once wrote a satirical vignette that touched on this. The blue people--aliens who resembled us only, y'know, blue--created the "races" of earth in a failed attempt to preserve the greatness of their dying species. Since we didn't live up to expectation, the blue race moved on to die elsewhere, and left us to do the same here.

In summation, the "master race" is none of us, they're dead and not coming back, and frankly, we were all garbage to them. =P

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An Over-Educated Grunt
1/23/2014 11:13:31 am

I think I saw something about that on a documentary back in the 80s. Show called the Smurfs...

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Mandalore
1/23/2014 11:57:46 am

That reminds me of a story from the Decameron (1.3). Saladin needed money and went to a Jewish banker named Melchezidek. Saladin tried to trick him, and this force the loan, by asking which of Islam, Christianity, of Judaism was right. Melchezidek replied with a story about a father giving his three sons identical rings indicating who was his heir. After he died the sons realized they each had rings and could not determine which was the rightful heir. So they had to accept that none could discount any others. A very good story that you reminded me of.

Of course there is also the story in the Decameron of the hermit Rustico and the girl Alibech putting the devil back into hell. A very funny story, but not relevant.

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Thane
1/23/2014 12:09:24 pm

I've always enjoyed the Decameron but it's been so long since I read it. I need to add it to my "Read list"

Thanks for reminding me.

Thane
1/23/2014 12:05:20 pm

I wonder how much of the racism in the alien and fringe history movement is a result of people who are attempting to seem smarter and more educated than they are or a result of writing for who they perceived to be their market?.....or a combination of both.

While some of the proponents of fringe history and alien stuff may not personally be racist on the micro-level, they don't seem to see that on the macro-level their views, fueled by poor research, education, and the need to be provocative, could be construed as, and in many case are, racist.

When a theory becomes a cherished belief, it is very hard for people to keep an open mind especially when the facts prove their beliefs to be erroneous. People don't like to learn they are mistaken/wrong and perhaps have been a fool.

On the other hand, some of them may be laughing all the way to the bank.

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Gunn
1/23/2014 01:16:17 pm

Yeah, Basketball Jones.

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Harry
1/23/2014 01:25:14 pm

I don't think that there is any question that von Daniken is a racist. Interestingly, the noted sceptic James Randi pegged him as one long ago, simply by noticing what he did and did not ascribe to extraterrestrials. As Randi noted, he did not include the Parthenon or Stonehenge "because these wonders are European, built by people he expects to have the intelligence and ability to do such work. He cannot conceive of our brown and black brothers having the wit to conceive or the skill to build the great structures they did leave behind." (Flim Flam (1982), p. 130)

Randi adds: "Try as he may, von Daniken cannot diminish the works created by greater men than he. For every giant, there is a little man to kick at his ankles." (Ibid.)

Amen!

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Gunn
1/23/2014 03:25:12 pm

As long as we're on the subject of racism, here's a parody on racism, as satire, to lighten us up. Something to chuckle over as a few of us say goodnight. (Toto always makes me crack up.)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=unl0qo4f8Xo&NR=1

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Joe
1/23/2014 03:57:05 pm

I am sorry but I have not made it a point to read EVD on a regular basis. But reading the excerpts provided it is clearly evident that his views are ridiculously racist. I find it ridiculous that anyone would defend or excuse such commentary. The nature of his comments border on the line of lunacy, I know some here think that Jason is overly sensitive to racial theories but I am not sure how anyone can defend EVD's comments.

Not to call anyone out but Steve posted earlier “We now return you to your regularly scheduled blog post and comments in which some poor new target is assessed as a racist.” I know that you were trying to be sarcastic or funny. But PLEASE defend EVD as not being a racist based on the obtuse comments above. You are the first to complain about personal attacks and the disdain Jason has in his reviews of Wolter material. But here is a non Wolter review that reveals the truly uneducated remarks from a fringe historian as the racist crap as it is and you can not prevent yourself from being a total ass and in a poor attempt in trying to be funny actually found a way to defend EVD.

Where are all the Wolter acolytes that complain about personal attacks against Scott on this one. Do you agree with Mr. Sinclair on his assumption tht EVD is not a racist and Jason is just attacking him. And before you claim that you are not defending EVD, I am just reading between the lines, similar to the claims that your group make.

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Gunn
1/24/2014 04:31:41 am

Just to clarify that the above reference was apparently accidentally attributed to myself, Gunn Sinclair, aka Mr. Sinclair; I am guessing it was meant for Mr. St. Clair, aka Steve. I am as innocent as the driven snow on this one, as I haven't commented about EVD at all.

As a footnote, it does seem to me that a person can use racist illustrations without being a racist, promoting racism. The parody I linked to here reveals this to be true. That was for humor, though. However, a parody doesn't have to always be considered satire to work.

So we see an example where racism can be viewed from a non-racist prospective. What of the bearer of racist news? What is in his heart? How, exactly, as we to judge him? We must judge him by his intent. We see what looks like an intention, but is it? Is there a desire to promote racist ideas...or is racist material being used inappropriately, but unknowingly?

Or, do some people ignore political correctness and push ahead, undaunted, yet their dogma not borne of racism at all?

This same analysis, or group of questions, could be made of Mr. Wolter, too, of course. He deals in some of these abstractions over race, but how can we possibly correctly judge him, either? People want to assess guilt, but it is difficult to nail down.

Some people actually do think that there are subtle differences in race which make for subtle differences in performance as humans. In other words, the question becomes: Are humans much different from other animals who may specialize in performance, or even appearance? By definition, it is racist to believe so.

The value we put to these differences is the problem, as each person is supposed to be considered as equally valuable, not only in God's sight, but also in society's sight, in general. But what of these talents and abilities and perceived shortcomings, and other variables? Are we really all the same? No.

We are all of the same value, but we are not all the same. Then why is it racist to see differences...beyond color, I mean? Are some physical attributes advantageous, and others a drag? Can we say so, or is this racist? Do some recognize this, but just not say anything, but others do?

I'm not defending EVD here, but I am suggesting that we may not have the whole X-ray of his heart. The same goes for Wolter, or anybody else referencing race--unless they are VERY CLEAR.

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Mark E.
1/23/2014 03:57:15 pm

It would appear that it was is the "ancient alien's" burden to spread Western culture to the "undeveloped" areas of the world.

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Seeker
1/23/2014 06:36:26 pm

Jason, thanks much for this blog. I was disgusted by these writings of EVD. And another simple definition of a racist is a person who believes a particular race is superior to another. You've provided numerous examples of EVD's racism, including writings about some races being more intelligent than others and a "chosen" race.

EVD's writings are racist and indefensible whether they were written 40 years or five minutes ago.

Yes, there's the added layer of his alien theories, but musings about whether the black race was a "failure" on the way to creating a white or yellow race is outrageously racist, no matter what else is tossed in. If the alien theories are distracting for people, simply replace aliens with God or any other Creator of one's choosing and the comments are still racist.

It intrigues me when people refuse to call out racism, even when there's clear evidence of it. Some people have gone as far as to say a comment is racist, but the person making it is not. Or if someone doesn't mean to be racist, he or she is not. Or if it was a long time ago, it wasn't racist. Excuse me?

If someone makes a sexist comment / writes or says comments that are discriminatory based on gender, he or she is a sexist. Why is it so difficult to admit the same thing when it comes to racism?

Racism is evident in a person's words or deeds--it's not like the offending person needs to agree he or she fits the title. Otherwise, were the people who enslaved Africans not racist because they didn't think they were? Or because slavery was widespread / "acceptable" at the time?

I've seen some painful semantic games going on in this thread i.e. "mainstream" political racism, or racism from a long time ago versus now or how because EVD's writings relates to alien theories they aren't racist and so on.

Bottom line: racism is racism. Whether it has been called out or not, whether it was deemed fashionable or not, whether a term existed for it or not--it was and always will be racist to believe you're better than someone else based on skin color, eye color, height or any other such factors. We all know it when we see it, hear it or read it--now let's just face it.

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YellowJacket One...formally Titus Pullo
1/24/2014 01:12:38 am

Any discussion on race is so politically polarized. That the human race has developed superficially differing characteristics can't be debated. Indo-European (I won't use Aryan for obvious reasons), Sub Sahara African, and Oriental. Visual observations show that when the three primary groups interacted/mated you had blending..see southeast Asia and the Middle East and now in many areas of the world as people move around. That is great for the species and allows for more diversity and hopefully a better species. That said there is nothing wrong with asking how the three different races begin. This goes back to the debate on how what is called "modern" behaviour started with modern humans. Since modern humans have been around for at least 100,000 years yet their tools and so on were at the same level of the previous humanoids out of Africa to Europe and Asia...where and when did the modern behavior start. There is the out of Africa theory versus the theory that the previous humaniods developed modern behavior as in a multi regional approach. Both seem to have the meager fossils record and some mitrochrondial DNA studies supporting their views. The multi regional theory has perhaps a little better explanation on how the three primary races came about. Interesting stuff and I'm sure the truth will be a lot more complex.

That said, cultures are not the same. Cultures that promote certain actions or characteristics can produce a higher standard of living than others..over time they can even move the abilities...for example cultures that promote mathmatics/engineering will over time have a higher percentage of people good in these fields. Humans by selectively promoting one they of characteristics (say even height) over time can create a culture with higher % of these characteristics than others. So in the end, cultures can be better than others. When race is involved in this, it can easily be viewed as "racism" for most ignorant people. The great thing is humans can easily get around cultural "genetics." When you look at say the technological advances of say China versus Europe versus Africa..the differences are obvious based on culture not intelligence.

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Seeker
1/24/2014 06:00:54 am

I agree there's no problem with asking and investigating scientifically why people have different physical features.

And sure, people can be bred (i.e. selectively promoted) to be taller, or have a certain color of skin, etc. but this starts to move into the area of eugenics, which is reprehensible.

We get into trouble when we start lumping people into categories and then ascribing one group as being "better" than another.

EVD's arguments divide groups, hold some above others and denigrate some groups deemed as lesser because they don't fit his worldview of what he considers the chosen race. This is racism.

Better is in the eye of the beholder. For example, some cultures believe it's better to live off the land, not pollute the environment, not have a television, etc. They value simple pleasures and standards of living focused around handicrafts, family, storytelling, etc. Other cultures believe it's better to have a huge home, luxury sedan, several large screen TVs, etc. Usually the judgement of "better" is based on one's own culture, and what one's personal culture values.

So different cultures value different things and it's subjective as to which is truly better. All cultures have certain benefits and characteristics (e.g. making medical advances) and disadvantages (e.g. invading and oppressing others).

We can all agree to a higher standard of living in terms of clean water and air--every human needs this to live and this is better. But for example, a particular culture may value technology and think this is what makes its culture better than others, however technology advances have led to tons of waste, pollution, exploitation of workers, etc. So what's truly better is more complicated than it seems once we step out of our own world view.

Instead of spending so much time on trying to figure out why people look different from one another and who is "better," cultural diversity in its truest form asks us to celebrate all cultures, respect people as they are and learn from one another--instead of trying to dominate each other and bend others into being just like ourselves.

Ideally EVD would believe all cultures have something to bring to the table in terms of intelligence, capability to build huge monuments, etc. Instead, he brings worn out stereotypes (e.g. “Nearly all negroes are musical: they have rhythm in their blood.” Really?). Perhaps if he approached other cultures with more respect and with a truly open mind, he would be able to understand what goes on in the hearts and minds of others.

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Gunn link
1/24/2014 04:57:22 am

It seems logical to suppose that three separate branches of humanity did not originate. I say this only because of the odds of humans developing at roughly the same time, with the basic same physiology. It seems to me that the odds of this happening are too astronomical for it to have occurred. The science of math should bear this out.

I try to apply this same kind of logic to other personal, off-subject interests, too. Odds, man, odds. It's mathematical and scientific.

Reply
J.A. Dickey
1/24/2014 05:38:32 pm

Gunn, check out John Hawks's blog and how he picked
up on a "braided stream' metaphor for how genetic drift
and all subspecies barriers are not categorical. We have
regional niches and immune system adaptions and the
small or large mutations over time leading up to grand branching out and niche specializations. rather than the branchings from a successful twig or fork as cul-de-sacs,
often like Peking Man DNA + also Homo Heidelbergensis
DNA entering the Denisovan genome, we get a few surprises.

Up until the results from a new testing,experts assumed
Homo Heidelbergensis was a just a less evolved & tall Neanderthal and no more. Genetics has upended all the
Victorian classification systems, even when the Victorians
had actually been scientific and logical. We are in the midst
of a big double helix revolution. Its not Geology in upheaval
at all, its GENETICS. We have had the regionalism verses
diversity debate, but what our DNA tells us all is more complex, \even as we are now looking at our epi-genome that almost
half legitimizes Lamarck due to how truly binary the "toggle"
switches in an "on" or "off" position are, due to what throws
them! Our life systems are complex as is the ecosphere we
are surrounded by, and all ecosystems. nothing is simple...

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Gunn
1/25/2014 04:02:25 am

Thanks for the reference. I'm basically saying that the fact of our life systems (human) being so complex has everything to do with my mathematical odds approach. What are the chances that all the races would be so similar today, yet having followed completely different evolutionary paths? I'm just saying that logic and mathematical odds seems to reveal that we all evolved from the same origin, at some point. We are all related, going back to a point. But then, mutations took over, making us all different. We are all related, but different, and we all have the same value as humans.

m. wilson
1/26/2014 03:45:39 am

Thanks for this. I wanted to weigh in on the totally fallacious idea of three "racial" stocks and the current state of knowledge in DNA. Hope it puts to rest some of the preceding bizarre speculation. Wonder how EVD explains the neanderthal DNA in all of us.

Ccv
3/7/2014 11:26:02 am

BTW...The Steel Helmet is a great little war movie that faces racism head-on.

Reply
Theomastix
6/15/2014 10:05:53 pm

Von Daniken is merely rephrasing very lucratively the old Theosophical teaching on "ROOT RACES", that later led to "Ariosophy", "Theozoology" and...Nazism. Hitler was a confirmed initiate of these occult societies obsessed Nordic-Germanic renewal, who often served as the " shell " of more earthly-minded gun-running radical right-wing counter-revolutionaries... (See the Thule society victims - all aristocrats, all blue bloods.)

The truth is, Theosophy is half-right in a lot of what it teaches, and moralism is no argument. Mainstream journals do not publicly allow it to be "disclosed", but if you actually dig heavy into any recent pharmaco-genomic journal or molecular evolutionary journal, you shall see what every one always knews to begin with... Europeans (specifically, Italians, Jews and Germans) are the cognitive elite of this planet, Northern Asians are somewhat advanced but the multiplicity and uniqueness of individual geniuses is simply lacking; the DNA shows decadent "Lemurians" of Australasian origin are blood-cousins to Negroid Pithecoids (technically, one cannot separate cleanly in genome and blood type, the ape and the Negroid - I am sorry); and that's just a damn fact, I apologize.

In any case, I don't know the specific lineage intellectually here, but these are well-known themes of the "Nazi mysteries" (along with the contactee reports of "Nordic Aliens", etc. - only struggle for the truth, and you shall find it in time...) and I am not sure what D.'s ultimate agenda is - is he not Jewish? I am. In any case, I hypothesize ROBERT CHARROUX, the Aryanist esotericist, has had his mark here... Not to mention Von Liebenfels and List, etc...

Reply
Canada
11/5/2014 03:26:41 am

Ridiculous. This is not racist and there ARE differences between races. We can list the physical differences and they can't be ignored unless you are blind; are you seriously saying that there are not cultural, intellectual, or otherwise differences as well between races? All people should be treated equal with equal rights but it is just plain ignorant to state that there cannot be different traits and strengths among races of the world...that sir is not racist at all.

Reply
Fabricio
11/1/2015 06:10:40 am

If the EVD actually said this, he needs a genetic lessons with Neil deGrasse.

Reply
Fucka You Dumbass
8/27/2016 04:00:19 am

You are a bitch. When intelligence comes you will be left behind.

Reply
Michael Anderson
9/11/2017 01:44:30 pm

Hmm...both EVD and several of the commentators here fail to grasp a couple of simple concepts relevant to the genuine, i.e. SCIENTIFIC understanding of evolution.

1) evolution does not imply "improvement" except insofar as it is advantageous to an organism's survival, which is always - ALWAYS - a matter of happy accident. An ape is not "less" than a human being, or its evolution somehow become petrified in amber: apes continue to evolve, just as human beings do.

2) ergo, African people did not "stop evolving" in Africa; in fact there is NO SUCH THING as race, and both light-skinned and dark-skinned people are obviously increasingly subject to the fallacy that melanin content of the skin or lip size are somehow indicators of "race." Horse crap perpetrated by racists irrespective of political spectrum, since if you define people according to the imaginary label of race, you are ipso facto a racist and your agenda of keeping the human species divided is as obvious as if you had it tattooed on your stupid ignorant mug. Dark skin is advantageous in the tropics, just as light skins is in the ultraviolet (and consequently vitamin D)-starved temperate zones, PERIOD.

That damnable fool Tsoukalos having no clue about his ancestral mythology is NOTHING compared to the average normatively educated person's complete ignorance of even the most basic principles of evolution - a total disgrace that casts our so-called public education systems in a very bad light, like THAT should surprise anyone.

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