Tuesday Roundup: Fake Scottish Stone Circle Fools Archaeologists and the Science Channel Goes on a New Search for Vikings in America

1/22/2019

It was a cold and icy weekend where I live in Albany, NY, with about 15 inches of snow and sleet falling on Sunday, followed by bitter wind chills on Monday, making cleanup difficult. I spent much of the holiday weekend digging the house out, only to have the snowplow come through and bury the driveway under four more feet of heavy ice blocks. Then, a starling fell down the chimney into the basement, and I had to chase a bird around the house until I could convince it to fly out a propped-open door into the cold. As a result, I didn’t have a lot of time for writing today’s blog post, and that turns out to be OK because the world of fringe history seems to have taken a bit of a breather over the holiday weekend. The big names were fairly quiet, give or take a snippy comment or two. I guess it’s just a quiet time of the year.

There were a couple of interesting news stories to point out from the past week. First, Scottish archaeologists were reportedly disappointed to discover that what they initially thought was an ancient recumbent stone circle in Aberdeenshire was nothing of the sort. The small stone circle was not in fact thousands of years old by only twenty, having been built by a farmer in the 1990s as a decorative folly.

Normally this would be a non-story for us, but what makes it interesting is that Adam Welfare of Historic Environment Scotland and Aberdeenshire Council’s Archaeology Service publicized the circle as a genuine ancient site in the media and spread the story all over Scotland, prompting the former owner of the land to contact him and confess to having built the circle himself.

“These types of monument are notoriously difficult to date,” said an assistant at the Aberdeenshire Council by way of explanation. He added that the former land owner did a really great job setting up the stones, and they were quite picturesque.

And that is a great example of why you don’t go trumpeting things in the media before doing the research! Imagine what would have happened if the former landowner had died or didn’t see the news?

Meanwhile, the Science Channel has announced a new series starring Blue Nelson and Mike Arbuthnot, who will attempt to discover whether the Vikings penetrated into the interior of North America, as so many speculative histories have suggested since the early 1800s. If those names sound familiar, they should. Cable is a small world of constantly repeating faces. Both men are archaeologists and veterans of the History Channel traveling circus. Nelson and Arbuthnot both starred in History’s Found, a 2016 one-and-done failed series in which they attempted to investigate antiques and artifacts discovered by members of the public. Arbuthnot also served as an archaeologist for America Unearthed, where in season 2 he participated in Wolter’s quest to find Viking settlements in the continental United States—coincidentally the same subject as his new series!

The new series, entitled, depressingly, America’s Lost Vikings, will be more scientific than America Unearthed and will use experimental archaeology techniques to test whether the Vikings had the technology and the gear to make the journey into the interior of the continental United States.

A Science Channel executive described the series in statement given to Real Screen last week: “The question of just how much of North America the Vikings explored hasn’t been investigated to this degree,” Science Channel general manager Marc Etkind said. “The latest scientific technology may help us answer just how far they got, where they went and who they encountered.”

You know, like Bigfoot or something. After all, what do we know about who was living in the Americas before Europeans?

The show’s executive producer at Arrow Media, the British company producing the show (and—disclosure—one that previously contacted me about appearing in a show that never made it to air), described Viking incursions into the continental United States as “one of the greatest unanswered questions in U.S. history.” I can’t see how that is true, but it is fascinating that the only major documentaries to air in the U.S. about the peopling of the Americas in the past few years have been about Europeans colonizing or exploring the United States.

This documentary follows the Vikings on what, to the best of evidence, are at best unproven incursions far south of their known settlement in L’anse aux Meadows in Newfoundland. The previous show, last year’s CBC/Smithsonian Channel documentary about the Solutrean hypothesis similarly followed prehistoric residents of Spain as they embarked on an almost certainly imaginary journey to colonize America before the Native Americans. Several shows on the Travel Channel (sister station to Science) have postulated that America was colonized by a race of Caucasian giants or by a completely different species of hominin rather than acknowledging Native Americans as the first peoples in the Americas.

The real question is why TV producers think it wouldn’t be equally interesting to watch experimental archaeologists try to recreate and test the various hypotheses for how Native Americans entered the Americas (ice-free corridor, coastal boats, etc.) and survived the Ice Age Americas.

56 Comments

EAGLE FEATHER

1/22/2019 09:00:42 am

My thanks to Jason Colavito for his thoughts.

It was the tremendous amount of resources in school, which didn't relay any relative information for fact, that caused me to seek other duties. It was frustrating to read babble.

It was the exposure to prominent myths which caused me to seek original content, and not the conjured opinions of those who read or translated original content, that made me study for the first time.

Right or wrong, it was a fun journey to go on before I pass. It would be fun for Jason and Scott to get together on something though. Feuds are fuel, but discourse is unfulfilling.

Take care, and keep the peace.

William Fitzgerald

1/22/2019 09:31:40 am

We know the Vikings made it to what is now Canada. We know the Vikings were able to "penetrate" into Eastern Europe. So, it is possible for the Vikings to have explored or "penetrated," if you want, into the interior of North America. There were certainty routes they could have taken and the methods they used in Eastern Europe would have worked in North America. The problem is this is all speculation. Outside of L'Anse aux Meadows there is no conclusive proof that Vikings were present anywhere else in North America (outside Greenland if you count this as part of NA); though it seems highly likely they did explore the Atlantic coast of North America, there is nothing much concrete. Which indicates their presence was fleeting and short-lived.

The best way to prove otherwise, in my opinion (short of a conclusive and major archaeological find-good luck), is Native American demography around this period.The Vikings very likely brought with them diseases that would have decimated native populations if contact was anything more than fleeting and restrained to more isolated populations along the north eastern coasts of North America. (I suppose its possible the Vikings were relatively diseases free, but this is doubtful). There is strong evidence of dramatic population declines across the Americas shortly after Columbus arrived. Did something similar occur around the times of the Vikings? If there was population decline, how wide spread and steep was the decline, and can we determine where it was concentrated? This to me, would be the best evidence towards proving the Vikings had a significant presence in North America.

Joe Scales

1/22/2019 10:45:22 am

"This to me, would be the best evidence towards proving the Vikings had a significant presence in North America."

Absent ruling out environmental causes too numerous to fathom. But what you bring up is probably better evidence to dispel the Wolterisms that would have bands of pre-Columbian Templars all over the place, carving rune stones, etching knights in stone and building towers. You'd figure you'd find a lot more evidence of their pursuits, and perhaps a mostly decimated native population as a result.

FOR THE RECORD

1/22/2019 11:33:31 am

I call on Mr. Colavito to summon the biologists.

There is no evidence that 'Indians existed' in America prior to Columbus, in line with the argument used against the Vikings. But academics accept their existence as fact. Why?

The Norse Vikings are widely accepted as being large strong men in earliest recorded time. Then, a number of centuries later. The Scandinavian Vikings are widely accepted as being thinner and less muscular. Proof as evidence that two species intermingled.

Phoenicians are widely accepted as being a naval society. When their society disappeared in Northern Africa, another naval society suddenly appeared in the Baltic Sea region. That produces a 'missing link' for academics. If they cannot come up with a probable cause, then it is evidence of 'American colonization'. 250 BC (which is widely accepted by academics)

L'Anse Aux Meadows is now widely accepted as Viking colonization (the return). Norse Sagas depict travels to the area around New York. Several archaeological finds have discovered keels of Viking ships around these waters (fact).

Do academics accept Viking Sagas from oral traditions?

Do academics have evidence that Mesoamerican pyramids were constructed by those who opposed the Viking civilization?

These two questions will reveal the truth.

Disease can be intentional. There is no argument for fact in this discussion because the causes cannot be determined unless you rely on opinion of the Greco-Roman conflict.

The design of 'Social Order' is evidence of the suppression of facts, providing evidence to the existence of facts not widely known. A decimated population would also resemble a burgeoning population drawn of two species intermingling.

Academics have to do much better to prove their conclusions. For they have the appearance of children screaming 'you did it'.

Line up the biologists. Mix the societies in order. Academics can't even prove a point, they rather prove everything they say is not fact.

1/22/2019 11:58:02 am

"There is no evidence that 'Indians existed' in America prior to Columbus..."

You mean they existed in India?

Perhaps some day you'll stick with one moniker, rather than allow your paragraph structure... or lack thereof... be your identifier.

American cool "Disco" Dan

1/22/2019 12:35:47 pm

And where are you institutionalized?

1/22/2019 12:51:33 pm

The Indus Colony Rehabilitation Center III.

An XR71 should be picking me up from my galactic port soon if they can ever get me unplugged.

1/22/2019 04:11:52 pm

Mental patient: Wouldn't it make more sense to use epidemiologists?

Uncle Ron

1/22/2019 04:32:27 pm

:. . . though it seems highly likely they did explore the Atlantic coast of North America, there is nothing much concrete."

Well, at least that should rule out Wolter's participation in the debate.

1/23/2019 12:40:36 am

If you look at Scandinavian expansion patterns, they only turned inland when they were forced away from the waterways by other peoples they couldn't handle. Their entire way of life was predicated on coastal living. It doesn't make sense for them to have gone inland BEFORE expanding along the coast. They also left a metric shitton of trash everywhere they went that is highly distinctive; it is beyond the greatest stretch of reason that they suddenly changed THAT in North America even if the native populations DID force them immediately inland. Ergo, the best evidence of Viking presence outside Nova Scotia would be...exactly the kind of evidence we have IN Nova Scotia, and all over Europe, Iceland, and Greenland, and even into the northern reaches of Africa: Scandinavian trade goods, buttons, clothing, embroidery, naalbinding, ships, etc. Their group of cultures were very much distinctive, just as much so as Roman and Celtic cultures were. "Plain" was not in their cultural vocabulary, so it should relatively easy to find traces of the very distinctive animal interlace they left in ABUNDANCE everywhere we KNOW they've been. Epidemiology isn't clear enough to pinpoint the specific cultural cause; it's not as if there weren't dozens of cultures that could have introduced new diseases to an area, and given that many of the diseases Europeans DID bring jumped to human beings from animals in the first place, that's actually very much a BAD way to prove "Vikings Were Here." It's far more likely to point to domestication attempts or intermingling of disparate native populations.

1/23/2019 01:47:02 am

I agree finding material culture remains is the best way to estiblish presence. But, when short of that standard, what can you use to establish a presence or help rule it out. Determining population bottle-necks, while imprecise, is one way. Will it tell us that Vikings were here? No. But, if a bottle neck can be estiblished as occurring around say 1000 years ago, then that is pretty good evidence.

BEAR CLAW

1/23/2019 06:59:25 am

Be more analytical.

The Vikings were a police force. Look for their precincts, not the homes and people they looked after.

1/23/2019 07:04:59 am

When you go into an average American household, you don't find badges, batons, tasers, and guns. That doesn't mean the Sheriff or Police Chief doesn't have a presence. Geez, wake up call.

1/23/2019 09:49:48 am

"But, when short of that standard, what can you use to establish a presence or help rule it out."

Make dumb stuff up?

A Buddhist

1/23/2019 10:17:21 am

V: Don't you mean "evidence of Viking presence outside Newfoundland would be...exactly the kind of evidence we have IN Newfoundland"? Because the Norse settled in Newfoundland, not Nova Scotia (as far as we know).

bear claw

1/23/2019 08:49:38 pm

Viking penetration inland - it's called a Sebring.

Don't you watch the news, the Vikings are trying to educate you.

Riley V

1/24/2019 06:36:52 am

I would hold that the “Vikings” penetrated many of the Scot maidens. Hence the Tradition of First Footing.

American Cool "Disco" Dan

1/25/2019 02:19:01 pm

Are you a Foot Fucker Focker?

Machala

1/22/2019 11:05:51 am

Jason,
It's summer here in Ecuador - shorts, tnank tops or tees, and flip-flops are the unfirom of the day !

William Fitzgerald,
Very good. I concur with your observations and suggestions. May I add that one of the reason I think that the "Viking" exploration to the West was sporadic and very brief was that the 'Norsemen' were driven by trade and plunder. If the lands to the west offered neither, then I doubt that the explorers would have stuck around. To the best of my knowledge we've never found any Native American artifacts among the booty brought back to Norway, Denmark, or Swedan, by the Vikings.

The early Norse and Danes were adventurous but they weren't stupid. If there was nothing to be gained, there was no sense in staying and establishing colonies - no reason for exploring too far inland on foot, away from the safety of their ships.

David Bradbury

1/22/2019 02:46:13 pm

"To the best of my knowledge we've never found any Native American artifacts among the booty brought back to Norway, Denmark, or Swedan, by the Vikings."
And that's despite the fact that the economy of Norse Greenland was export-driven, notably supplying walrus ivory which can be identified in large numbers of carved European artworks.

orang

1/22/2019 09:11:25 pm

I once read a book which tried to show that Norsemen penetrating into North America. It talked a lot about the KRS as real and about stone mooring holes along waterways. The unique thing in the book was that it claimed that the Norsemen in Iceland and Greenland, once they converted to Christianity, paid tithes to the Catholic church, and these tithes were usually paid in trade goods, not money. Furs were part of the tithes, and usually included animals that did not exist in either country. These animals could only be found in North America. I don’t know what kinds of animals they were, but the claim was made that the Vatican has records of these tithed goods. Anyhow, this went on for a couple of hundred years. The author said that it indicated that the Norsemen either collected the furs from a trading post collection system on the east coast or from extensive interior trapping on their own. I don’t know how true any of this is.

1/22/2019 09:19:33 pm

Good luck in Ecuador! Out here in the Marianas the uniform of the day is still the uniform of day, despite the endless summer (and no mountain to retreat to).

The Vikings were undoubtedly interested in plundering and pillaging, but as evidenced by their retreats in Iceland and Greenland, they were also interested in settling. When they arrived at their arctic outposts there was not much to plunder and very few to pillage and yet they stayed (or tried to in the case of Greenland).

Greenland ultimately failed, probably the land was a little too harsh even for the Vikings. Climate change (medieval warm period to mini-ice age), and possibly pressure from proto-inuit peoples (possibly the infamous Skraelings) also contributed to the failure. Making Greenland and L'Anse aux Meadows the first of many European colonies to fail in the new world. While Iceland thrived.

One reason may have been distance. Iceland was already a remote outpost and Greenland, nevertheless L'Anse aux Meadows (or Vineland), were perhaps a bridge-to-far. Remote colonies are often not self-sufficient in the short term and require support from home and a steady stream of settlers to find success. Viking settlers were perhaps not too intetested; and like you said without much prosoects of plunder it was not worth the risks.

Not to mention by the time the Vikings "discovered" North America the Viking age was nearing the end (unless you count Norman adventurism which at any rate was interested in conquest within the known world).

So, while the Vikings were interested in plundering, they were also interested in settling. But, for whatever reasons neither prospect kept them engaged in North America. Unless proven otherwise, their impact must have been fleeting and likely impacted lightly populated and isolated locations along the Atlantic coast; not the middle of North America.

BIG EAGLE

1/22/2019 11:28:54 pm

What about the 'North Star Trail' from Corpus Christi Texas to Mounds Park Minnesota? Pretty middle of the road.

All the Runestones still exist and are at your disposal for viewing.

1/22/2019 11:32:08 pm

The Vikings traded with the women of the Vatican, to reduce their size.

The Normans are shrunken Vikings.

Shane Sullivan

1/22/2019 11:22:12 am

I had a family of grackles living in my furnace last year. The babies were easy enough to remove by hand wrapped in a blanket, but the mother was a bit more cagey. Like you, I had to chase her around until she flew out the door--fortunately for me it was a warm May evening.

So, we're Bird Brothers now, you and I.

SWAN, CROW, then PENQUIN

1/22/2019 11:46:41 am

It's too cold outside, I want to go south for the winter. Oops, that's a reason to colonize America.

1/22/2019 05:40:37 pm

And yet another reason why the Kensington Runestone is fake. It's significantly warmer in Oslo right now than it is in Kensington.

POLAR BEAR

1/22/2019 06:34:32 pm

“Followers of Thor. The journey north is long, it is not to be taken after the solar equinox. Take only those who are strong enough to survive such a journey. A river flowing north will lead you to the sea. When you come to a great sea, place your Runestone along its shore. The Knights will come for you.”

1/22/2019 07:37:40 pm

Two questions:

What the hell is a "solar equinox"? and

Where are you institutionalized?

1/22/2019 07:59:53 pm

1/22/2019 09:16:23 pm

Jason, permission to urge "For the Record" to kill himself?

1/23/2019 09:54:48 am

And take the cosplayers with him...

"Big" Tom English

1/23/2019 12:13:36 pm

In keeping with the off topic tone of some of the comments, I wish to inform everyone that I have a thirteen inch penis.

1/23/2019 01:25:19 pm

In which orifice?

Greeks

1/23/2019 05:11:12 pm

Our brains are 13 miles long. Squished inside our skulls, the tube has created so many synaptic connections it appears as a single 3-lobed object.

1/23/2019 07:40:52 pm

They call us Tripods. We have been here all along. Our brains have recorded everything. We don't need to read someone elses OPINION to make an argument. The facts speak for themselves.

1/22/2019 06:49:20 pm

“Go no further north, winter seasons will seize from thee what the trek has not already taken - Zeus Orin Thorval, 1002 AD.”

BIG FEATHER

1/22/2019 06:59:27 pm

Only a chieftain is allowed to speak the language of the ancestors. “It is our good fortune that their men are not red with blood, or we would not be standing as tall.” - Chief Beowulf

Campblor

1/22/2019 09:20:26 pm

If America’s Lost Vikings is going to be more scientific, then they will need the services of a forensic geologist... just so happens I know a guy 😀

An Anonymous Nerd

1/23/2019 12:25:20 am

So much that could be said....I'll just say a few of them I guess.

1 - Why, I wonder, the obsession with Vikings. Why are so many so ready to associate themselves with bloodthirsty raiders and pillagers?

2 - [“The question of just how much of North America the Vikings explored hasn’t been investigated to this degree,” Science Channel general manager Marc Etkind said. “The latest scientific technology may help us answer just how far they got, where they went and who they encountered.”]
Ummm...What? The question's been dealt with scientifically for years now. First with a serious analysis of the sagas that suggested the early settlement, then eventually the discovery of an actual site. What will this show offer that's any different? Probably nothing; or made-up stuff; or the older stuff repackaged in a manner that is described as brand new. You know, like the stuff about the Viking graves.

3 - "There is no evidence that 'Indians existed' in America prior to Columbus, in line with the argument used against the Vikings. But academics accept their existence as fact. Why?" Because there's archaeological evidence; because what was described by the Europeans (starting with Columbus!) could not have been true had their cultures not existed in the Americas for long before the European arrival.

4 - With much of the Fringe there simply is so much assumed that it approaches, or passes, the level of a religious faith. Except the religion makes no demands on you and disguises itself as something else.

-An Anonymous Nerd

1/23/2019 06:55:20 am

1. Cowboys are Indians, or should we say Indians mixed with Vikings. Bloodthirsty? Just a myth, what evidence do you have that says otherwise?

2. Vikings did not colonize, they raided. No woman is going to give herself to a large man unless she think them a god. This is how people shrunk themselves in the old days. They set up colonies of other people.

3. You just made an argument for the Vikings. They were here when Columbus arrived and met their subordinate classes. It's like you going to a gospel mission and saying the deprived were not Americans because they didn't have cars and microwave ovens.

4. The religion of raiding parties is written in the Bible, followed by the church. How they raid is the only thing that changes. New technology and drugs now, over peer pressure and mythological guidance then. Violence was the act of a few desperate men which signifies the downfall of that era.

1/23/2019 07:27:49 pm

[You just made an argument for the Vikings.] No I did not. There is archaeological and other evidence for cultures that had nothing to do with Vikings.

[No woman is going to give herself to a large man unless she think them a god.]

So sports groupies think the sports dudes are gods, eh? The lead singer of the metal band Type O Negative was pretty big. I guess his groupies also thought he was a god. Not in the figurative sense, in both cases, but in the literal sense. Sure.

[ It's like you going to a gospel mission and saying the deprived were not Americans because they didn't have cars and microwave ovens.]

Huh?

[Cowboys are Indians, or should we say Indians mixed with Vikings. ]

Huh?

[Bloodthirsty? Just a myth, what evidence do you have that says otherwise?]

Bunch of books and documentaries and shit that relay archaeological and documentary evidence of it. Nothing that'd interest you I guess.

-An Anonymous Nerd

Bear Claw

1/23/2019 07:37:41 pm

1. The Vikings had to mix with someone. Cited.
2. Indians brought out of forest to Greek Temple. Gods. Cited.
3. Cars, microwaves are American tools, no tools found at the mission then academics say they are not American... as you Cited.
4. Moors were moors until they became Indians, Indians were Indians until they became Cowboys. Fathers- Vikings Sons- Normans.
5. There is no evidence that Vikings were bloodthirsty. The books you Cite are FICTION.

The EVIDENCE is piling up against you. You can't prove anything you spout, unless it is OPINION which is FICTION.

Jim

1/23/2019 10:22:03 pm

Nobody likes a bitter confection.

1/23/2019 11:16:57 pm

And a sizeable percentage of cowboys were black so when did the Indians and the Vikings go to Africa to make black people? Where the original American blacks came from is not in doubt because the Jew slave traders kept receipts and other records.

Jason fakes

1/23/2019 02:29:25 am

What not a word loser about the Stolen Valor phony Vietnam vet harrasing children along with leftist bigots? Like you.

1/23/2019 10:00:10 am

I don't believe Jason jumped the gun on that one. Nor is it any relation to what's being discussed. Fair is fair, you know. So off with you and your bullshit politics.

1/24/2019 12:55:49 pm

You know... I liked this place much better when there was just one fake indian.

1/24/2019 04:13:59 pm

What's your definition of an Indian?

My Phy Ed teacher thought I would be a better shot at archery.

At the time:

51 inch chest
28 inch waist
27 inches each thigh
21 inch biceps
19 inch calves

Me teacher thought me an Injun.

1/25/2019 02:17:50 pm

Ladies and Gennimen, this is what is known in the trade as "a fucking lie".

https://heightline.com/arnold-schwarzeneggers-height-weight-measurements/

Accumulated Wisdom

1/29/2019 09:36:26 pm

Brilliant Minds of this Blog,
(Not Joe Putz or Dan Schmuck)

When did Benedict Arnold start using Pentadic numbers on his "Windmill"?

A military man using obsolete notations??? Makes no sense to me.

Amphibian Cool "Disco" Dan

1/30/2019 01:44:47 am

You stupid, stupid, stupid heterosexual faggot.

There are no pentadic numbers on the Newport Tower.

Benedict Arnold never served in the military.

Sad.

1/30/2019 02:07:45 am

I shall return to piss on your ashes, Felcher. Enjoy docking with Joey Putz. AKA Niel Dickson Dan's mouth

How's the view from a sinking Battleship? You shit-stain on the face of humanity.

My urine shall was you away.

Ambiguous Cool "Disco" Dan

1/30/2019 03:10:49 am

Are you a piss fetishist Focker? Maybe you should run crying to Wolter after he told you not to come here.

You stupid, stupid, stupid heterosexual faggot.

There are no pentadic numbers on the Newport Tower.

Benedict Arnold never served in the military.

Sad.

1/30/2019 10:13:51 am

Though rattling a lunatic's cage can be fun and all... given Anthony's complete mental breakdown on multiple threads now, well... that's where I get offboard. Don't have the heart to worsen his condition. And it's worsening. Bigly.

Anarchist Cool "Disco" Dan

1/30/2019 01:17:00 pm

I have Szaszomania so I will continue to treat him as a normal person as long as he tries to pretend to be a normal person.

Also I want to find out what having my ashes pissed on is like.

I have nipples Anthony. Can you milk my nipples Anthony?

Your comment will be posted after it is approved.

Tuesday Roundup: Fake Scottish Stone Circle Fools Archaeologists and the Science Channel Goes on a New Search for Vikings in America

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